InVinoVeritas

I wonder if you have seen the news that one of the terrorists involved in Friday night's attacks in Paris was carrying a Syrian passport and entered the EU by landing on the Greek island of Leros last month?

Stuurman

Yeah, very convenient the terrorist carried his passport when doing the attack don't you think?

Oh and btw our PM Mark (Malek Ramadan) Rutte also has a Syrian passport:
Syrisch paspoort voor 'Mark Rutte'|Binnenland| Telegraaf.nl

InVinoVeritas

The terrorist who carried out the Charlie Hebdo attack had his passport on him as well, so there you go!

bakedbean

Yeh, I thought that at first. But then thought... Well, he either was

(a) going to detonate himself then passport would be blown to smithereens

or

(b) maybe was thinking of escaping after (so might need the passport if he got away).

But, who knows.

Yes IVV, it's a real problem with the open borders within mainland Europe. If Greece (or another country) is not doing thorough checks, these terrorists can end up anywhere in the mainland.

Gunnar45

Ayway, one or some of them was/were identified from fingerprints.
But for the suspicious minded that can of course also be a conspiracy....
Regarding Greece not doing its job, just notice the international indignation over Hungary trying to do just that!

JC3

From the BBC:

Syrian passport discovery 'throws spotlight on migrant route'
BBC's Turkey Correspondent Mark Lowen
Posted at 18:10
The BBC Turkey Correspondent Mark Lowen says a Syrian passport found at the scene of the attack has big implications.

"The discovery of a Syrian passport near the body of one of the attackers has thrown a spotlight back on the migrant route - and on Turkey as the key transit country.

"The authenticity of the passport is still unclear: Frontex, the EU's border agency, warned earlier this year that Syrian passports were being forged as they were more likely to be accepted for asylum.

"The fear for the genuine refugees will be that this case could turn the political narrative against them, fuelling those who say Europe's doors should now be shut."

JC3

columbine

Just on the morning TV news the brother and mother of one suicide bombers are under custody, another son is still missing. The boys were born in France. The dead guy had been to Algeria with his "little girl".

Gunnar45

JC3,
'genuine refugees'??
Isn't it so that a refugee from a war ceases to be a war refugee when he has entered the first country outside of the war zone?

JC3

[QUOTE=Gunnar45;11795096]JC3,
'genuine refugees'??
Isn't it so that a refugee from a war ceases to be a war refugee when he has entered the first country outside of the war zone?[/QUOTE

Is that so? I don't know

JC3

JC3

It seems that cannot be the case Gunnar because someone is not officially a refugee until they are outside the country of their nationality. The UN refugee convention that was drafted more than half a century ago states:

the term “refugee” shall apply to any person who...owing to a well-founded fear of being persecuted for reasons of race, religion, nationality, membership in a particular social group or political opinion, is outside the country of his nationality, and is unable or, owing to such fear, is unwilling to avail himself of the protection of that country.

So it seems that they can't be a 'war refugee' until they have left their country.


JC3

Stuurman

Most if not all attackers seem to be EU residents. Closing borders will not keep these guys out.

columbine

Just on the afternoon news, France is looking into people from that region.of the world that hold dual nationality, mulling over if they leave they cant re-enter.

InVinoVeritas

I read that a little differently. At the moment France cannot rescind nationality so Hollande wants to modify the Constitution to give the Courts that power. I think even that will prove difficult let alone the next step of actually taking away someone's French nationality. Cameron wanted to remove the right of re-entry for those going to join the jihad but I think that has bogged down too.

columbine

The news was live on TV. So not sure what's the final outcome in the G20 meeting.

Gunnar45

JC3,
Sorry, I expressed myself wrong.
What you say is exactly what I meant.
With the adding that the refugee ceases to be a refugee in any other country than the first country he fled to.
With this said, someone who for example fled from Syria to Turkey can claim refugee status there. But he can hardly claim to be a war refugee when moving from Turkey to a better life in Europe.
The situation in Europe is quite absurd with people travelling around, shopping for the best standard and benefits and transiting 'bad' countries to reach the better ones.
Of course they can be understood, I think we would given the opportunity during a similar situation all do the same.

But if it comes to get the most bang for the buck and to be able to help the larger quantities of refugees out of misery (look at the reports from some of the camps), the money would be better spent on tented camps in the border regions of neighbour countries than to arrange accommodation in Europe. (Sweden i now considering tented camps as there is no more other accommodation available!)

The politicians in Europe are of course fully aware of this, so why are they then sending out the signals to the conflict areas of the possibility to come to a good life in Europe instead of acting like say Australia?
Not only are they cheating the poor people and who pay the people transporters to come to them to face a life crammed into ghettos and unemployment, they are also increasing the burdens of their own populations by overloading healthcare, schools and other social services.
And without these signals there would not be so many drownings in the Mediterranean!

Does anyone really believe that the decision and opinion makers do not know this or are naive do-gooders?
So, again, why is it happening?
A good start for conspiracy theories.