robbyasti

I am slightly confused but to my understanding one must be at the age of 67 and already receiving a UK pension to be able to transfer to INPS for a combined pension. Is this correct or could it be done earlier?

Geordieborn

Unless things have changed a lot there is/was no such thing as a transfer on contributions from one EU country to another. You can/could use each others contributions to be used to qualify for any qualifying year or other requitement. The resluting calculation done by both countries is a pro-rate pension and if it is greater than that calculated on that states pesion calculated under their contributions only then that's what paid. In the UK's case that is/was rarely the case. Just another small point, if you were born in 1955, then you UK pension age according to this is 66 not 67! Not too sure what the state pension is for Italy these days, but they can pay using your UK contributions if needed. You don't need to do anything to get details it is al done between the UK (this lot) and INPS. For my sins I worked there many years ago and actually calculated these pension entitlements. It may be things have changed, but I suspect it's more "lost in translation" with the INPS. Best way to find out is to either call or write to the UK half and ask how things work. If it is still the same then either way will involve a lot of waiting..

Geordieborn

Sorry folks my mistake of the pension age, I should have read the OP correctly "age 55", not "born 55"...

Serrano

Hmm, I feel the need of more information to even approach a reasoned choice here. Do you know (even approximately) how the UK - I presume it's them who would do it - works out the transfer value. I guess once that's done it's relatively easy to then make a calculation of how much you would get in Italy vs. the UK.

Though then for the future we have two further big unknowns:

1. Each country's policy - just as examples
   the triple lock appears to be a significant benefit for as long as it lasts
   each country will use different actuarial bases - and thus a different return on each £/€ in the pot - depending on their longevity
   there MAY not be index-linking of UK pensions after Brexit
   
2. Exchange rates

And of course which country's administration you trust most (in my case, neither really )

Geordieborn

More curiosity than needing to find out if you can “transfer” your UK contributions, but it might help others to know. Okay this is not a site I know, but it came up on a search and kind of outlines how things worked up to at least Dec12 and is my understanding from what I know used to apply. I would be astounded if this has been changed to “transfer” your contributions totally as it is so complex in as much as it covers each countries insurance scheme. I also think if it came in after Dec12 it would still be coming up in web searches all over. I do think the term “transfer” is being mistaken for “taken into account”. The two main areas where this could be useful in the UK is to satisfy the minimum (there is one) qualification and maximum (depends on year born) qualification number of years in your working life. The maximum has been well documented here, but the figure is that needed to get the MAXIMUM UK state pension. If you don’t have that number of years it does NOT mean you get no pension, it’s simply a percentage reduction. It used to be that, that reduction could not be below 25%, if it is/was, then you get nothing. That’s where any other EU contributions come in and can be used to qualify you to get below that 25% limit put into payment.
Anyone wanting a better explanation of their own circumstances I’m happy to try to help via a PM.
One small point on the above, technically this is not just EU countries, as far as I’m aware the UK still has reciprocal agreements with countries outside of the EU where similar calculations can and do apply.

jonwel

That's my impression too. I was told that it's not a question of transferring contributions but just that the two agencies together see if you've been paying for enough years and then each pays its part. I geti my British part directly by bank transfer from the UK. Is that not always the case? Does anyone get their British part through INPS?
By the way, I started to get my British part when I turned 65 in 2014, while INPS started to cough up when I reached 66 and 9 months (August 2016).

modicasa

what a tangled web.... INPS told me the pensions would be 'amalgamated' and I would receive just the Italian pension which would take into account my UK contributing years. More delving to do, I assume....

jonwel

I've just thought that it may depend on how your pension is calculated and whether you have enough contributions in a single country to go it alone or only have enough if they are added together.

robbyasti

I have 35 years paid in the UK and 16 here in Italy. I have an appointment at Inps next week and hopefully things will be clearer. I am pretty sure that I will have to wait until retirement age in both countries before receiving any kind of pension.
I will keep you updated

Serrano

Well, certainly for the UK Pension you will have to wait - there is no system of which I know that allows withdrawal of even 1 penny before you reach Statutory Retirement Age. On the basis of my imperfect knowledge, Italy does not implement a fixed age at which you can start drawing your pension - it is a combination of age and years of contributions. I would imagine (though this is more logic than knowledge) that your UK and Italian contributions together would be used for this calculation.

But you should also bear in mind that the earlier you start to draw the less you get (per week) for the rest of your life. Probably much less, because you'll be paying in for fewer years and drawing out for more years (more than 10 years difference on each in your case). So don't be surprised if the INPS offer is miserly to say the least.

Serrano

New posting as for some reason the system won't allow me to edit the previous one.

1. Good luck, and
2. Please let us know how you get on

robbyasti

Thanks. I hope to continue working but I need to be prepared because my job is a risk due to a company merger. Not easy to find another job in Italy at 55.
I will certainly let you know of my visit to Inps next week. It should be interesting!

Geordieborn

Modicasa, more I read the more I think you need to get in touch with the International Pensions Centre here and ask them if what you have been told is true, I'm convinced it's not!

modicasa

Thanks Geordieborn - Ill drop them a line - I tried at the CAB when i was in the Uk last, and they couldnt help.

robbyasti

I went to INPS and I was told that 43 years of pension contributions are required to obtain a pension from INPS. Italian and UK contributions years can be combined to reach the required 43 years. Voluntary NI contributions paid in The UK while working in Italy are not counted by INPS.
Basically, I was told that you can obtain a pension from INPS (for the contributions paid in Italy) when you have 43 years in total. The amount is likely to be below 400 euro, depending on the years worked in Italy. We require a minimum of 22 years of INPS contributions to obtain the state minimum of 550 euro.
The U.K part of the pension will be paid at 67.