Moving to Tuscany
#16
BE Enthusiast
Joined: Oct 2009
Location: pretoro abruzzo italy
Posts: 436
Re: Moving to Tuscany
Just a quick thing to add, electricity and water, as Chris is an electrician (qualified to British standard European norm) we'd be looking at heating water with solar, electricity from solar and wind turbine (small ones) wood burner etc, as much of it coming from renewable sources as we possibly can.
Our budget will depend greatly on how much we sell our property here for in 3 years and how much we have in savings.
Our budget will depend greatly on how much we sell our property here for in 3 years and how much we have in savings.
#17
Re: Moving to Tuscany
This is great, thank you everybody for all your comments, they're invaluable to us, as the pro' sand cons are exactly what we need as we're not experienced in the ways of Italian life.
Rash decisions aren't our way, so getting the inside edge is precisely why we joined the forum as we want to make as best an educated decision as we can, holidays just don't show the real side... I've lived in cornwall for nearly 20years... people on holiday assume we live and work on the beach in eternal sunshine, not the case!
I want to reply individually, but so much has been said, I'll just focus on the main bits;
- Permits and licences etc, we figured it would be as bureaucratic as the UK, but there's not a lot of info as to what exactly is required, but I'm assuming the Commune /town council would be the people to approach.
- language, speaking Italian is a must, it goes without saying, we will be having lessons long before we move, even if we decided not to move, we'd still learn the language, cultural enrichment never hurt anyone
- Planning permission, I can foresee being a stumbling block, although, I'm hoping we can make it clear that we don't want to build something different, we are looking to renovate "sympathetically" as it's the rural architecture that we love. The campsite is intended to be as modern as possible, but to make as little impact on the landscape/environment as possible.
- Location, we ideally want to be north for the skiing in winter, if there's potential to capitalise on that too, then we'd have winter sorted!
- If winter can't give us an income in Italy, we could, worst case scenario come back to UK for a few weeks and earn some cash in our respective careers.
We generally live pretty frugally as it's getting Very expensive to live here, particularly in storm battered cornwall, so budgeting doesn't bother us.
Sorry for rambling, please keep the advice coming, it's unbelievably helpful
Rash decisions aren't our way, so getting the inside edge is precisely why we joined the forum as we want to make as best an educated decision as we can, holidays just don't show the real side... I've lived in cornwall for nearly 20years... people on holiday assume we live and work on the beach in eternal sunshine, not the case!
I want to reply individually, but so much has been said, I'll just focus on the main bits;
- Permits and licences etc, we figured it would be as bureaucratic as the UK, but there's not a lot of info as to what exactly is required, but I'm assuming the Commune /town council would be the people to approach.
- language, speaking Italian is a must, it goes without saying, we will be having lessons long before we move, even if we decided not to move, we'd still learn the language, cultural enrichment never hurt anyone
- Planning permission, I can foresee being a stumbling block, although, I'm hoping we can make it clear that we don't want to build something different, we are looking to renovate "sympathetically" as it's the rural architecture that we love. The campsite is intended to be as modern as possible, but to make as little impact on the landscape/environment as possible.
- Location, we ideally want to be north for the skiing in winter, if there's potential to capitalise on that too, then we'd have winter sorted!
- If winter can't give us an income in Italy, we could, worst case scenario come back to UK for a few weeks and earn some cash in our respective careers.
We generally live pretty frugally as it's getting Very expensive to live here, particularly in storm battered cornwall, so budgeting doesn't bother us.
Sorry for rambling, please keep the advice coming, it's unbelievably helpful
10 time more! All you mention, solar etc needs permits, and you pay tax ( fotovoltaico )Eaolic ? That would be interesting to see how the comune will respond to that !
#18
Just Joined
Thread Starter
Joined: Feb 2014
Location: Cornwall, UK
Posts: 10
Re: Moving to Tuscany
Linseed oil, funnily enough, we were just looking at property in Abruzzo. Our options are very much open, it's a case of finding the right property in the region that feels right, we won't rule anywhere out.
Highlander1, the UK requires permits and licences to get permits and licences, under our fantastic current government, the tax payers are paying for the sins of the father (the labour government) and paying taxes in order to cover up the swindling of the MP's fraudulent expenses and the banker's bonuses...suffice to say, paying taxes in Italy or paying taxes in the UK is 6 of one and half a dozen of the other.
The advice on here has been fantastic, we've joined the forum because we're newbies and other people's experiences will prove hugely helpful.
Just to clarify, the campsite we have in mind, is not some kind of holiday camp hell, our ideal is something small, family orientated where people would want to return year on year, and guests can escape the rat race. We have no problems with going down the required routes to do a proper job, there's no point going at it without being adequately prepared.
Highlander1, the UK requires permits and licences to get permits and licences, under our fantastic current government, the tax payers are paying for the sins of the father (the labour government) and paying taxes in order to cover up the swindling of the MP's fraudulent expenses and the banker's bonuses...suffice to say, paying taxes in Italy or paying taxes in the UK is 6 of one and half a dozen of the other.
The advice on here has been fantastic, we've joined the forum because we're newbies and other people's experiences will prove hugely helpful.
Just to clarify, the campsite we have in mind, is not some kind of holiday camp hell, our ideal is something small, family orientated where people would want to return year on year, and guests can escape the rat race. We have no problems with going down the required routes to do a proper job, there's no point going at it without being adequately prepared.
#19
BE Forum Addict
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 2,508
Re: Moving to Tuscany
Remeber that Tuscany will not allow new build in the countryside, nor wind turbines, nor solar in many areas. It doesnt matter whether you are thinking of building sympathetically - a camp site requires access roads, cleaning facilities, drains, septic tanks etc etc - adn that is what will hold you up. You need to find a place either where there is an existent site and buy it, or a place where there are no 'vincoli' on what you want to do.
#20
Re: Moving to Tuscany
http://doingbusiness.org/rankings
Good luck anyway.
P.S. http://cpi.transparency.org/cpi2013/results/
#21
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Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 2,508
Re: Moving to Tuscany
Sancho is spot on. Here's one example. In the UK a VAT registered is 'rewarded' for collecting a tax for the government. You do your questerly VAT return yourself (if you like) send the money you owe, or send in the debit slip and in a fortnight you get a rebate. In Italy, there is no incentive mechanism. You pay your IVA by the due date, using an accountant who has no legal responsibility for the hash he may make of it, or get a swingeing fine. Have a debit? Good luck, you will wait 5 or 10 years before and if the tax office give you a rebate.
#22
Re: Moving to Tuscany
Remeber that Tuscany will not allow new build in the countryside, nor wind turbines, nor solar in many areas. It doesnt matter whether you are thinking of building sympathetically - a camp site requires access roads, cleaning facilities, drains, septic tanks etc etc - adn that is what will hold you up. You need to find a place either where there is an existent site and buy it, or a place where there are no 'vincoli' on what you want to do.
#23
Lost in BE Cyberspace
Joined: Feb 2013
Posts: 6,148
Re: Moving to Tuscany
Especially as it's Tuscany. It would be easier to do it in Austria or Slowenia if it's nature you're looking for.
#25
Just Joined
Thread Starter
Joined: Feb 2014
Location: Cornwall, UK
Posts: 10
Re: Moving to Tuscany
Ok, thanks for all the comments, Rome wasn't built in a day, but we're not looking to achieve anything overnight, we have plenty of time to research and wade through the red tape or look at alternatives. Life is too short to let negativity stop you trying things.
#26
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Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 2,508
Re: Moving to Tuscany
Quite right too. Just go into it with your eyes open and dont let your heart rule your head. Personally I would think of other places than Tuscany, mainly because I suspect it is already saturated with places to stay.
Down here in Sicily we have very few campsites, which is a shame, because it would certainly help tourism - so try and find somewhere where you can do something new, or buy the only one in existence!
Down here in Sicily we have very few campsites, which is a shame, because it would certainly help tourism - so try and find somewhere where you can do something new, or buy the only one in existence!
#27
BE Enthusiast
Joined: Oct 2009
Location: pretoro abruzzo italy
Posts: 436
Re: Moving to Tuscany
Quite right too. Just go into it with your eyes open and dont let your heart rule your head. Personally I would think of other places than Tuscany, mainly because I suspect it is already saturated with places to stay.
Down here in Sicily we have very few campsites, which is a shame, because it would certainly help tourism - so try and find somewhere where you can do something new, or buy the only one in existence!
Down here in Sicily we have very few campsites, which is a shame, because it would certainly help tourism - so try and find somewhere where you can do something new, or buy the only one in existence!
property prices half of tuscanshire
but there again don't rush in blind have a holiday or twoi in your choosen area or rent for a while before you buy
#28
Just Joined
Thread Starter
Joined: Feb 2014
Location: Cornwall, UK
Posts: 10
Re: Moving to Tuscany
Abruzzo is certainly very appealing, as is Sicily (I'd always assumed Sicily to be a harder area for Brits to settle, but glad to hear it's not so, just my pre-conceived idea) but there'll be plenty of holidays over the next few years and without a doubt we'd rent before we bought, because you can never tell what a place is like until you've actually lived there, and a level freedom is a must.
Thanks again for all advice.
Thanks again for all advice.
#29
Lost in BE Cyberspace
Joined: Feb 2013
Posts: 6,148
Re: Moving to Tuscany
I don't think people are negative, but 8 out of 10 people will fail. Have you ever thought of doing some working holiday at a campsite to really see how it works? The other thing about Sicily is that people don't want to camp there, as it's far too hot during summer. There's always a market for motorhomes, but most will rather pick the air-conditioned apartment or hotel.
#30
Re: Moving to Tuscany
Is this the sort of thing you're aiming at ?
http://www.laprugnola.it/#
If so, it may be worth thinking carefully about what there're offering, who they are, how they work, etc. Note the yurts.
There are a few TA reviews too. On the whole they're the usual gushy "Do you recognise who wrote this?", "Call them by their Christian names to show how we thought of them as friends" type of stuff, but you may be able to find something of solid interest by reading between the lines
http://www.tripadvisor.co.uk/Hotel_R...a_Tuscany.html
http://www.laprugnola.it/#
If so, it may be worth thinking carefully about what there're offering, who they are, how they work, etc. Note the yurts.
There are a few TA reviews too. On the whole they're the usual gushy "Do you recognise who wrote this?", "Call them by their Christian names to show how we thought of them as friends" type of stuff, but you may be able to find something of solid interest by reading between the lines
http://www.tripadvisor.co.uk/Hotel_R...a_Tuscany.html