PMM

Hi Wen

She has to be declared as non accompanying.

PMM

Lostris

Ok so if they are to be included as "dependant children" and included on the 2nd form do we still have to get medicals done on them? They are 13, 15 & 16.

To be honest, the thought of them following us to Canada is my worst nightmare (believe me, you've not met them ).

PMM

Hi Lostris

No, if they are declared as non-accompanying.

PMM

Andrew Miller

But if they won't undergo medicals then they won't be ever eligible for sponsorship. And your husband must write to visa post his own affidavit that he relinquishes any right to sponsor them in the future and thus asks for their medicals to be waived.

Lostris

So we add their names on the Additional Family Members form and also send a letter saying we don't intend for them to come to Canada with us?

Or do they just go on the Family members form with our children who live with us but we just tick "non accompanying"?

Also do you have to submit medicals with your application form or do they come at a later date?

Headhurts

If you put the children down as non-accompanying and send in the affidavit, does it warrant any special attention (ie.. are you more likely to be called for an interview, etc...). Also, what happens if you are currently paying maintenance. How do you convince the immigration officer that you intend to continue paying when you get employment in Canada?

Headhurts.

Lostris

My head hurts with all these complicated forms to fill in too!

Isn't it compulsory for you to continue paying maintenance regardless of which country you live in?

gooding

We have similar situation.

Part of our reason for naming children and allowing them to have medicals is if for any reason, say something happens to their birth mother, and you needed to get them to you quickly the CIC have all the info on the children in order for them to process their visa quickly. This is good especially if the children are young, and unable to speak for themselves, and often fathers are kept from the children, but the kids may want to be with him later.

If you omit the children off the forms you would have to explain why. If and when the children ever might decide they want to live in Canada , they would have to apply just as you are doing in their own right. You will never be able to sponsor them as a child or an adult. ( People change, especially kids) What you think of them now may be different in 5 -10 years time.

If you named them on all forms and agreed to having medicals then you can sponsor them, thus making things quicker for them.

By totally leaving them off, you will have to back up the reasons as previously said. The parent will give up all rights to sponsor them. If the kids are under 18, and if they had no one other than the mother caring for them and something happened to her what would happen to the children?

You do have to give evidence of how you intend to support all dependent children, with the application.

If maintence is being paid you will need to show all you have, to back up claims...... Divorce papers, custody orders, court orders, bank statements CSA statements.
Also statements letting them know how you intend to keep on with these payments once you leave.

Uk has recipricol arrangements regarding getting maintence payments within Canada.
Apparently the CSA has no legal authority to collect payments from parents who have emigrated, so many fathers / mothers think they may be able to escape paying. However, the parent in UK can apply through a court here to have the Canadian courts get the money. This is not worth doing as you could be in big trouble with PR in the long run. (not saying you would) but this is one reason why the CIC will want to know how and if you intend to carry on supporting kids.

It is a very difficult situation when children are involved, and ex-partners.
If the children are under 16, I think they should be included if at all possible, kids change and you must think of the future, not right now. Problem may be getting the medicals done if asked!
The medicals are done prior to visa being issued, assuming all is OK with all applicants health. If one of the step children had a medical problem, then your application could be turned down. Would you resent the child if this happened??

Read the guidelines notes on the CIC website a few times. It takes a while to sink in, but it becomes easier to understand eventually. I filled in the forms with a copy of the guide by my side, and your right it makes your head hurt!
The more you read the wiser you become.

JAJ

All this assumes the other parent will even *allow* the parents to have medicals. Often this is the fundamental problem.

One wonders if it would be possible in that kind of unusual circumstance to apply for the children to come to Canada on compassionate grounds. Andrew - is there any opening for situations like this?

Jeremy

Andrew Miller

No, there isn't. No kids' medicals when parent immigrates = no sponsorship of those kids ever.

JAJ

In a situation where custodial parent refuses permission for kids to do medicals, and then the custodial parent died a few years later (an exceptional circumstance), wouldn't the door be open for the Minister to look at the case personally under s25(1) of IRPA?

Jeremy

Andrew Miller

Jeremy,

there always be some room for extra-extreme circumstances to be reviewed on individual basis, but rules so far have been designed and intended to keep abusers at bay. There were tons of cases with divorces and custody of medically inadmissible kids granted to non-immigrating spouse and then right after landing of non-custodial parent couples "miraculously" reconciled and sponsorship process was initiated on H&C grounds. Current rules are at least trying to prevent such and similar abuse.

The example you are talking about if far from any game abuser would even consider to play.

gooding

If a parent had sole custody then I would have thought the only way to get medicals done without a fight is to apply to a court to do so.
If you had joint custody then the father still has rights. Again it might mean having to go to court to get the mother to allow permission to have them done.
Neither parent could remove the child from the country without the others permission. So if the mother thinks that by having medicals done, it could mean the father taking them away from her, a court or solicitor could explain that this is not the case. It is the long term welfare of the child that is of concern. the chilren will have the right to do what ever they want when they are old enough to speak for themselves, and ultimately that is what you would be doing. just giving the children a chance to chose for themselves where and whom they may live with in the future.

One of my step children has just started University and does not really know what she wants to do.( especially as we have no real idea when and if we will get residency) The other is younger and told what to do by his mother.
We know he would love the chance to go in the future, and that is what we are doing by having them named on the application.

When they feel they can free themselves from their mothers side of the family then they can have the option of joining us in the future, assuming we get in.

Lostris

But do you have to put the step children who don't live with you on BOTH forms IM0008 and IM5604 if you are sure they would have no intention at the MOMENT of moving to Canada later on.

My husband does not see his children on any regular basis and as far as i'm aware when he got divorced (about 8 years ago) his ex got sole custody. He just saw them at weekends.

He pays maintenance and intends to continue to do so. Although by the time we move to Canada his children would be at least 19,18 & 16. I can't imagine their mother ever letting them emigrate to Canada.

So i can't see that either them or their mother would be happy about the medicals. Do we not just put them on the Additional Family Members? (IM5604)

I don't understand why we need to put them on both forms.

Tiaribbon

What about step-children who are in their 30's? I have 2 step-"children" who are in their 30's and are unlikely to come to live in Canada. I am the Principal Applicant and I did not mention the lads in my application. I assumed as they are not dependent, are not mine and are over 22 that I would not need to include them in my application.........have I made a grave error?