Residency

Old Sep 2nd 2013, 11:36 am
  #16  
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Default Re: Residency

Originally Posted by fidobsa
( I still don't like the use of the word "residency" as that is a different thing).
But Fib, it's what we all know and love - present company excepted - it would too confusing to change it and I have enough confusion in my life
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Old Sep 2nd 2013, 11:42 am
  #17  
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Default Re: Residency

Originally Posted by Yeoman
I agree. I would rather have residency than not, but it seems from the 2011 thread that getting residency isn't always that easy. Hence I was worried that I would be stuck with a house without residency and a chance of being deported. Knowing that not having residency is highly unlikely to get me investigated/deported is important to know. Thank you both for your comments. You have remedied my concerns.
It really depends what your long term plans are and if you are 100% sure Hungary is where you want to be. I know of several couples/families who have moved here and then back within the space of 18 months - deciding it wasn't for them. Renting to start with would at least let you experience the country and make an informed decision.
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Old Sep 2nd 2013, 11:47 am
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Default Re: Residency

Originally Posted by Rural Hungary
But Fib, it's what we all know and love - present company excepted - it would too confusing to change it and I have enough confusion in my life
I think it best if we just agree to differ on this.
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Old Sep 2nd 2013, 11:48 am
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Default Re: Residency

Originally Posted by fidobsa
I think it best if we just agree to differ on this.
I agree with you on that one Fib
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Old Sep 2nd 2013, 2:03 pm
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Default Re: Residency

When I wanted an internet contract I also had to produce my registration card for that. I have heard of others getting internet without a card but T Home / T Mobile (Magyar Telecom) insisted on it even for a 3g dongle pay-as-you-go.

You also need the card to sign up for the Hungarian health service. You can use an EHIC card but you can't renew one issued in UK if you are not living in UK. In my case, I am a registered landlord in UK so I can't get away with claiming my house there is available for me to live in part time.
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Old Sep 2nd 2013, 2:16 pm
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Default Re: Residency

Originally Posted by cathyg
You need to be aware not only of the Hungarian system but the UK as well. How will you evidence that you are resident in the UK if you are not living there. I believe if you are intending to be out of the country for more than 6 months you become classed as non resident.
Originally Posted by fidobsa
When I wanted an internet contract I also had to produce my registration card for that. I have heard of others getting internet without a card but T Home / T Mobile (Magyar Telecom) insisted on it even for a 3g dongle pay-as-you-go.

You also need the card to sign up for the Hungarian health service. You can use an EHIC card but you can't renew one issued in UK if you are not living in UK. In my case, I am a registered landlord in UK so I can't get away with claiming my house there is available for me to live in part time.
Implications of residency are all things I hadn't considered. Thank you all for the knowledge.
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Old Sep 2nd 2013, 2:38 pm
  #22  
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Default Re: Residency

Ditto to what everyone else is telling you.
Registration is quick and easy if you can prove you have money to support yourself, I was not asked for and didn't supply any information about health care.
As an EU citizen you have the right to be in any member state that you wish.
Personally I have found the Hungarians if anything over friendly, and as long as you sweep your pavement and use the corner shop sometimes then they are warm and welcoming and very tolerant of some of our strange habits.

As for 'risk', getting up in the morning is a risk, but if you want to look back on a full life then you need to take a few now and then, but a move to Hungary I would suggest will not be one of them.
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Old Sep 6th 2013, 6:28 am
  #23  
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Default Re: Residency

I'm confused as to what one would lose if one becomes a Hungarian resident?
As far as I understand it.
- One wouldn't lose their UK citizenship/residency by becoming a Hungarian resident.
- I can understand that one might prefer to pay tax on income in the UK.
If I obtained a residence card and live in Hungary > 91 days, but lived in the UK > 183 days. Meaning I am a tax resident of both countries. Do I get to choose country the country I pay tax income tax to, on my worldwide income?
- Do I lose access to UK NHS and/or European health insurance if I become a Hungarian resident?

Last edited by Yeoman; Sep 6th 2013 at 6:31 am.
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Old Sep 6th 2013, 7:43 am
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Default Re: Residency

If you obtain a residence permit but spend >183 days in the UK, any income is taxable in the UK though income earnt in Hungary is taxable in Hungary.

Part of the residency application is health care entitlement. There is a thread on how long your UK entitlement covers you once you have become resident in another EU country - or you can find information here

From the EU:
Whilst it is possible to be resident in two countries, you should be aware that this can have very concrete implications e.g. on taxation, car registration, social security, etc. For that purpose, your country of residence is the place where you "habitually reside" in other words, where your "centre
of interests" is, based on criteria such as the duration of your presence on the territory of the countries concerned, but also your family status and ties, your housing situation, the place where you pursue your activities, the characteristics of your professional activity and the source of your
income. In any case, you will have to register as resident in Hungary if you stay there for over 3 months. If you do not de-register in the UK, make
sure your effective residence is clear on all sides in order to avoid legal complications.
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Old Sep 6th 2013, 8:03 am
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Default Re: Residency

I think I've read the thread you refer to, but imo it was not clear.

The link states "If you are moving to another European Economic Area (EEA) country or Switzerland on a permanent basis, you will also no longer be entitled to medical treatment under normal NHS rules.".

Annoyingly it doesn't define what 'permanent' is.
Is permanent a factor of owning a house in that country but not in your resident country.
Is permanent a factor of being a 'resident' of that country.
Is permanent a factor of time spent in the country: 365days, 364days, or > 183days etc.



There seems to be so much grey legislation surrounding Europe. If that is the case, then I guess not worrying about it until you need it might be the best course of action.
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Old Sep 6th 2013, 8:23 am
  #26  
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Default Re: Residency

Yes, it can be confusing.

Last edited by Rural Hungary; Sep 6th 2013 at 9:30 am.
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Old Sep 6th 2013, 8:49 am
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Default Re: Residency

http://www.worldwide-tax.com/hungary/hungary_tax.asp
"To be considered a permanent Hungarian resident, there are a number of criteria to be met, such as ownership of an apartment, the permanent place of residence of the family and the criterion of spending more than 183 days a year in Hungary."
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Old Sep 6th 2013, 9:22 am
  #28  
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Default Re: Residency

Let me make it clear to you then.

Firstly, don't confuse domicile residency with Tax residency ... they are two very different things

Firstly, you don't have a choice on tax. You pay tax in your country of tax residence, and that is worked out by the number of days you spend in that country. So if you live in a country over the prescribed time to become a tax resident, you should make a tax return there. There are things you should still declare in the UK, such as Government pensions and property rentals, but all else is declared in your country of residence. There are normally dual tax treaties between countries, and therefore you wont end up paying tax twice. If you pay tax on income in the UK and you are tax resident elsewhere then you can deduct that tax paid from your tax return in your new country.

Once you become a domicile resident in the UK, i.e. you are no longer a resident in the UK, you lose your entitlement to usage of the NHS. It would be fraudulent to use their services as a non resident (this may change soon). You will not be able to renew your UK driving licence (legally).

If you or your spouse are of retirement age then normally you will be able to get health cover in your new country. Certainly, dependent on your NI payments you will be entitled to up to 2 years health cover in the new country by contacting DWP Newcastle.

Whether you declare yourself as resident in Hungary or not if you exceed the time limits, well, that's up to you ... but no one can tell you what kind of a risk that would be. As far as tax residency is concerned, well, I would regard that as a little more of a risk because there are normally financial ramifications associated with it.

One thing is for sure ... if you decide to commit yourself to a new country then its best to play it by the rules. It can be a stressful time anyway, so making it more stressful by trying to hide yourself probably isn't what you need
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Old Sep 6th 2013, 9:23 am
  #29  
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Default Re: Residency

Originally Posted by Yeoman
http://www.worldwide-tax.com/hungary/hungary_tax.asp
"To be considered a permanent Hungarian resident, there are a number of criteria to be met, such as ownership of an apartment, the permanent place of residence of the family and the criterion of spending more than 183 days a year in Hungary."

I think you will find that is TAX residency, not domicile residency
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Old Sep 6th 2013, 10:13 am
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Default Re: Residency

Originally Posted by Mitzyboy
I think you will find that is TAX residency, not domicile residency
Originally Posted by Mitzyboy
Once you become a domicile resident in the UK, i.e. you are no longer a resident in the UK, you lose your entitlement to usage of the NHS.
Learning about Domicile residency clears nearly everything up. Here is a link on Domicile for any future readers: http://www.hmrc.gov.uk/international/domicile.htm


Any future readers, please know that deciding domicile in itself is a grey area. http://www.hmrc.gov.uk/manuals/rdrmmanual/RDRM24000.htm
"if you have a domicile of origin outside the UK, then this is likely to still apply unless you intend to remain in the UK permanently or indefinitely."

'Permanently' and 'indefinitely' are subjective words.

Reading in to the above for my personal situation. Say I buy a property in Hungary. I do not have property in the UK. I intend to 'try out' and live in Hungary 9 months, and then return to the UK for 3 months in my first year, but by no means do I have definitive plans to live 'permanently' or 'indefinitely' in Hungary. Therefore my domicile is still the UK, and it will be until that mind set changes.

Mr H is my best comparison: http://www.hmrc.gov.uk/manuals/rdrmmanual/RDRM24060.htm
If say I had children and brought up my children in Hungary, then Hungary would certainly my domicile.
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