Moving Away
May 12th 2015, 4:37 pm
#31
Born again atheist
Joined: Jul 2005
Location: Europe (to be specified).
Posts: 30,259
May 12th 2015, 4:45 pm
#32
Forum Regular
Joined: Mar 2015
Location: Aquitaine
Posts: 143
Re: Moving Away
INTOURS asked if I think one can experience France better in a city, town or country.
I answered for myself personally and I explained why.
I am completely in agreement that HAVING to work is different than not having to work but there is nothing in the OP which says s/he HAS to work. It could as easily have been written by a retiree.
I am surprised that some in here think living a life is only for those who work in the conventional sense. That retired people don't actually touch the Real France. Rather closed minded I think. The REAL Britain exists outside the workplace on the terraces and pubs, in front of tellies and tablets, in the takeaways and on the TV. Not in offices where you could be anywhere doing anything.
IMO there is a difference between the "making ends meet" reality and the "being cognisant of the country/culture you live in" reality. The former does not satisfy the latter nor the latter satisfy the former.
The OP asked about integration...my examples of integration were meant to describe what IMO integration is. The OP seemed to want to integrate...I suggested these sorts of things are necessary to integrate. Instead of calling me names perhaps you would like to disagree politely...Another question...
What do you think it takes to integrate into a country which is foreign to you and can you do that best in a city, town or village?
I answered for myself personally and I explained why.
I am completely in agreement that HAVING to work is different than not having to work but there is nothing in the OP which says s/he HAS to work. It could as easily have been written by a retiree.
I am surprised that some in here think living a life is only for those who work in the conventional sense. That retired people don't actually touch the Real France. Rather closed minded I think. The REAL Britain exists outside the workplace on the terraces and pubs, in front of tellies and tablets, in the takeaways and on the TV. Not in offices where you could be anywhere doing anything.
IMO there is a difference between the "making ends meet" reality and the "being cognisant of the country/culture you live in" reality. The former does not satisfy the latter nor the latter satisfy the former.
The OP asked about integration...my examples of integration were meant to describe what IMO integration is. The OP seemed to want to integrate...I suggested these sorts of things are necessary to integrate. Instead of calling me names perhaps you would like to disagree politely...Another question...
What do you think it takes to integrate into a country which is foreign to you and can you do that best in a city, town or village?
May 12th 2015, 4:52 pm
#33
BE Enthusiast
Joined: Sep 2014
Posts: 331
Re: Moving Away
France and French living?
PERSONALLY all cities are pretty much the same. If I want to experience French culture I can't do that in a city. The real France is out picking grapes in the vineyards or castrating maize, tasting different local breads and olives and pates...listening to patois and dialect and to different music and watching different sports. It is knowing the difference between a Bearnaise beret and a Basque one. It is knowing subtle differences in jokes and stories, about knowing the best waterfalls or the relationship between the woman who lives over the road and the one who lives in the next village. About who owns that field and the reason a house I used to live in is called Marquemal. It is about local French football and rugby teams and the rivalry between them.
It isn't about cars and work and stress and crowds...I can have that in London or Lyon. It is for me about a representative special place that goes deep into history and tradition. And incidentally, I doubt very much is ANYONE can "know" French culture. Every twenty miles there is another wrinkle in it. I have driven the length and breadth of France and it is startling how many "cultures" there are.
Like Novo I prefer a small town within an hour of a largish city...if for nothing else for the hospitals and theatre and concerts and art and shops. But IMO those aren't culture ..they are diversions I can find in London or Berlin or New York.Real culture is to be had sitting around an old plank table drinking local wine and chatting to the old men in the village or round the fire in the evening with shepherds and farmers. They are still there with their grandchildren on their knee listening to what they will be telling their children.
I personally feel if you haven't touched this intimacy with France you haven't known the country. You have merely lived in France.
PERSONALLY all cities are pretty much the same. If I want to experience French culture I can't do that in a city. The real France is out picking grapes in the vineyards or castrating maize, tasting different local breads and olives and pates...listening to patois and dialect and to different music and watching different sports. It is knowing the difference between a Bearnaise beret and a Basque one. It is knowing subtle differences in jokes and stories, about knowing the best waterfalls or the relationship between the woman who lives over the road and the one who lives in the next village. About who owns that field and the reason a house I used to live in is called Marquemal. It is about local French football and rugby teams and the rivalry between them.
It isn't about cars and work and stress and crowds...I can have that in London or Lyon. It is for me about a representative special place that goes deep into history and tradition. And incidentally, I doubt very much is ANYONE can "know" French culture. Every twenty miles there is another wrinkle in it. I have driven the length and breadth of France and it is startling how many "cultures" there are.
Like Novo I prefer a small town within an hour of a largish city...if for nothing else for the hospitals and theatre and concerts and art and shops. But IMO those aren't culture ..they are diversions I can find in London or Berlin or New York.Real culture is to be had sitting around an old plank table drinking local wine and chatting to the old men in the village or round the fire in the evening with shepherds and farmers. They are still there with their grandchildren on their knee listening to what they will be telling their children.
I personally feel if you haven't touched this intimacy with France you haven't known the country. You have merely lived in France.
You made a really good point earlier in the thread about how French families are very close and spend most of their spare time together. Well that is so true.
I arrived in France at the age of 25 and married into a French family. Every holiday is spent somewhere in France in a family members ancestral home. From the Vosges to Nantes, from Besançon to Montpellier. From rural to city from city to rural...been there done that for 17 years. I think I can tick your 'French' intimacy box.
To suggest that all French cities are the same is silly talk. I have lived in Paris and I have lived in Lyon. They are chalk and cheese. They may as well be in two different countries. Both equally as nice.
I will stand by my point, French living/culture today is more representative in cities than in rural villages.
My mother and farther in law who grew up in rural villages in opposite ends of France have retired in a nice 'modern' town just outside a city. Just happens to be one of the most sought after cities in France to live in. They would never contemplate retiring in rural France.
I am sorry Bonnet you have not got to grips with France yet.
May 12th 2015, 5:05 pm
#34
Quien no sabe
Joined: Dec 2012
Posts: 3,989
Re: Moving Away
So many points I don't know where to start.
You made a really good point earlier in the thread about how French families are very close and spend most of their spare time together. Well that is so true.
I arrived in France at the age of 25 and married into a French family. Every holiday is spent somewhere in France in a family members ancestral home. From the Vosges to Nantes, from Besançon to Montpellier. From rural to city from city to rural...been there done that for 17 years. I think I can tick your 'French' intimacy box.
To suggest that all French cities are the same is silly talk. I have lived in Paris and I have lived in Lyon. They are chalk and cheese. They may as well be in two different countries. Both equally as nice.
I will stand by my point, French living/culture today is more representative in cities than in rural villages.
My mother and farther in law who grew up in rural villages in opposite ends of France have retired in a nice 'modern' town just outside a city. Just happens to be one of the most sought after cities in France to live in. They would never contemplate retiring in rural France.
I am sorry Bonnet you have not got to grips with France yet.
You made a really good point earlier in the thread about how French families are very close and spend most of their spare time together. Well that is so true.
I arrived in France at the age of 25 and married into a French family. Every holiday is spent somewhere in France in a family members ancestral home. From the Vosges to Nantes, from Besançon to Montpellier. From rural to city from city to rural...been there done that for 17 years. I think I can tick your 'French' intimacy box.
To suggest that all French cities are the same is silly talk. I have lived in Paris and I have lived in Lyon. They are chalk and cheese. They may as well be in two different countries. Both equally as nice.
I will stand by my point, French living/culture today is more representative in cities than in rural villages.
My mother and farther in law who grew up in rural villages in opposite ends of France have retired in a nice 'modern' town just outside a city. Just happens to be one of the most sought after cities in France to live in. They would never contemplate retiring in rural France.
I am sorry Bonnet you have not got to grips with France yet.
May 12th 2015, 5:23 pm
#35
BE Enthusiast
Joined: Sep 2014
Posts: 331
Re: Moving Away
In a rural village in Bourgogne where my OH has inherited her families ancestral home there is an English expat couple who have a holiday home. According to the local 'gossip' retired farmer (we get the news when we go every summer) they stay in doors and play computer games all day.They don't of course....
French farmers and French village life....
What are they saying behind your back
May 12th 2015, 5:30 pm
#36
Lost in BE Cyberspace
Joined: Apr 2008
Location: Hérault (34)
Posts: 8,890
Re: Moving Away
[QUOTE=Bonnet;
I am completely in agreement that HAVING to work is different than not having to work but there is nothing in the OP which says s/he HAS to work. It could as easily have been written by a retiree.
[/QUOTE]
In another thread, the OP (or his partner) is a qualified nurse, wondering about the possibilities of working in or near Bergerac. Due to a double-posting, that thread got abandoned and became this one, but with no mention of needing to work.
I am completely in agreement that HAVING to work is different than not having to work but there is nothing in the OP which says s/he HAS to work. It could as easily have been written by a retiree.
[/QUOTE]
In another thread, the OP (or his partner) is a qualified nurse, wondering about the possibilities of working in or near Bergerac. Due to a double-posting, that thread got abandoned and became this one, but with no mention of needing to work.
May 12th 2015, 5:43 pm
#37
Forum Regular
Joined: Mar 2015
Location: Aquitaine
Posts: 143
Re: Moving Away
Intours, what bit of "IMO there is a difference between the "making ends meet" reality and the "being cognisant of the country/culture you live in" reality. The former does not satisfy the latter nor the latter satisfy the former" don't you understand?
What part of "I prefer to live in a small town close to a city" don't you understand? You mentioned your marital family retired to a small town near a city...how is that different from what I said my preference is?
You do not have to live in a city with all its dirt and noise and pressure. By the traffic that goes into and out of Toulouse, Bayonne, Pau and Bordeaux every day I am pretty sure there are millions of French people who commute from outside the city into it to work.
If you think I am talking about a tiny hamlet somewhere in the back of beyond, no thanks unless I were Buddhist monk. But for the third and final time, a small town withing travel distance of a city to work in is my preference.
I didn't speak for French people...I spoke of French culture...the OP asked about integration and you have not answered what you mean by integration. In honesty 19 years in France isn't enough to integrate fully into most French families and how do you know what they think of you behind your back?
I doubt very much if anyone can integrate in one generation...just as they can't in GB.
I must have done something right...I bumped into an ex neighbour in Pau two days ago whom I hadn't seen in 10 years. He recognised me and we had a great time reminiscing. He could has easily have walked past.
The OP seemed to want a quieter life, not one on the city. I replied accordingly. If you want to play one upsmanship about who is best integrzted into France I am not taking part. It is childish and silly. You get out of France what you consider valuable and I will do the same. What I know of France over many years is too long and complicaed to write up here so please, carry on.
What part of "I prefer to live in a small town close to a city" don't you understand? You mentioned your marital family retired to a small town near a city...how is that different from what I said my preference is?
You do not have to live in a city with all its dirt and noise and pressure. By the traffic that goes into and out of Toulouse, Bayonne, Pau and Bordeaux every day I am pretty sure there are millions of French people who commute from outside the city into it to work.
If you think I am talking about a tiny hamlet somewhere in the back of beyond, no thanks unless I were Buddhist monk. But for the third and final time, a small town withing travel distance of a city to work in is my preference.
I didn't speak for French people...I spoke of French culture...the OP asked about integration and you have not answered what you mean by integration. In honesty 19 years in France isn't enough to integrate fully into most French families and how do you know what they think of you behind your back?
I doubt very much if anyone can integrate in one generation...just as they can't in GB.
I must have done something right...I bumped into an ex neighbour in Pau two days ago whom I hadn't seen in 10 years. He recognised me and we had a great time reminiscing. He could has easily have walked past.
The OP seemed to want a quieter life, not one on the city. I replied accordingly. If you want to play one upsmanship about who is best integrzted into France I am not taking part. It is childish and silly. You get out of France what you consider valuable and I will do the same. What I know of France over many years is too long and complicaed to write up here so please, carry on.
Last edited by Bonnet; May 12th 2015 at 5:57 pm.
May 12th 2015, 5:49 pm
#38
Forum Regular
Joined: Mar 2015
Location: Aquitaine
Posts: 143
Re: Moving Away
This silly game of "I was here first" is annoying and childish. It is one reason why I normally tend to stay away from Expats. We all have expectations and needs and ways of appreciating a country.
May 12th 2015, 5:52 pm
#39
Forum Regular
Joined: Mar 2015
Location: Aquitaine
Posts: 143
Re: Moving Away
Every modern house is sought after by the locals I have said it before and will say it again a new build will sell so quickly here the paint won't have time to dry. The market appears stagnant but anywhere with that many old houses up for sale would be any prospective buyer that comes here gets 15 to 30 visits of housing stock that will never shift on the off chance they buy.
May 12th 2015, 5:58 pm
#40
BE Enthusiast
Joined: Sep 2014
Posts: 331
Re: Moving Away
Talking of which. Today I saw a very expensive blue 'trimmed up' UK Reg Range Rover sport with personalised number plates on the motorway. They were not on holiday with the absence of luggage. That parked outside your new French pad in rural France is not going to score any points. Not that they care methinks.
May 12th 2015, 6:05 pm
#41
BE Forum Addict
Joined: Apr 2009
Location: Scotland & Touraine [37]
Posts: 3,019
Re: Moving Away
OK guys - this thread isn't going anywhere - why don't we call it a draw and move on to another thread. 
May 12th 2015, 6:10 pm
#42
Hostage Negotiator
Joined: Jun 2013
Posts: 5,173
Re: Moving Away
I think the reasoning behind what CS says is that most French buyers need a mortgage and most French banks prefer to lend on a new property which has a 10 year guarantee rather than old one that has no guarantee at all. The absence of acceptable structural surveys is the real problem here for older properties.
May 12th 2015, 6:10 pm
#43
Forum Regular
Joined: Mar 2015
Location: Aquitaine
Posts: 143
Re: Moving Away
if you think a smile and being "cool" is the surefire road to integration then we are very far apart.
May 12th 2015, 6:20 pm
#45
Forum Regular
Joined: Jul 2014
Location: Normandy
Posts: 66
Re: Moving Away
Just stay put.....it is hard work in France.