L'Acajou

Hi All

A tedious question but I can't find an answer on the forum, or anywhere else for that matter! We have succesfully imported our Landy from the UK and a classic fiat from Italy, however, with this, we are stumped

We need to register a 2004 Ifor Williams cattle trailer, bought in the UK, to get a carte grise etc. We have the certificate and attestation of conformity. Do we have to physically take it to the Drire for testing? I have the forms which suggest they can be posted, or faxed but no mention of actual cost.
Presumably then we go to the prefecture, then can get the immatriculation number. Has anyone gone through this process? I think it would be the same for a caravan. Any idea how much it would cost, I can't find anything out from the websites.
We bought the trailer and may now sell it on as we now have three , once we have got it registered, does the registration now stop with the trailer or would a new owner have to have it re-registered?

Sue

Im_and_Er

If you have a Certificate of Conformity then there should be no need to go to the DRIRE, just go to the Prefecture and register it.

One word of caution though, Ifor Williams trailers homologated in France are not necessarily identical to those sold in UK and you may find that your UK C of C doesn't cut it in which case you will either need one from the French concessionaire or indeed have to pay a visit to the DRIRE after all.

Yes, a new owner will have to re-register it in his/her name.

L'Acajou

Hi Im and Er

Thanks very much for your reply, at last this is all starting to make sense! We think trailers after 2002 are acceptable, ie shouldn't need to go to the Drire, the one we arrived here with is older so would be more tricky. We'll go to the prefecture and see how we get on.


Sue

tramblygoat

Hi, it has been some time since you posted on this thread but I was wondering how you got on? I am wanting to bring a new IF trailer to France and need to know what to watch out for.

Any reply appreciated

Regards,

Mark

L'Acajou

Hi there

Since then we have brought in quite a few trailers - my husband is quite an expert! They need to be 2004 onwards to obtain a certificate of conformity. Ifor Williams now employ a Frenchman to deal with the paperwork, but have increased the price from 100€ to 200€ for the Certificate and they take several weeks to process. The admin is done in Wales, I can pass on the address if you need it.

Just be aware that as trailers don't yet need a UK log book, they may be stolen, we know several farmers in the UK who have had theirs stolen - this is why the UK are introducing log-books - so be careful when you buy. We ask for the serial number, which is unique, we check with Ifor Williams to see if it is OK. They will not issue as Certificate if it has been reported stolen.

If you need any more info, don't hesitate to ask!

Sue

tramblygoat

Hi Sue,

Interesting and thanks. I thought it was still 100€ and that was too much. They really have a cheek asking 200€.

I'll be buying a new trailer from an Ifor Williams UK dealer so Is it still necessary to visit the DREAL these days? I imagine the answer is yes?

What I wanted to do was to get the trailer insured in the UK (there is trailer only insurance available) so that I could pull it back to France with my French registered car. If not it means buying the trailer blind, getting the sales invoice and UK COC sent over to me, writing to IW France, waiting 3 weeks or whatever, then getting a carte grise temporaire and a plate before I can actually go to the UK to get the trailer back to France. What a pa-lava!

Can I ask how you have been getting your trailers over to France?

I do know that Ifor Williams are often stolen. I will be getting a good quality wheel and hitch lock. I didn't know the UK were going to go down the French route - I better move fast or it'll get so complicated I'll never fathom it out!

Regards,

Mark

L'Acajou

We have been told by a friend who is an Ifor Williams dealer that Ifor Williams will not sell to a person with a French address - this is to protect the IW few dealerships they have in France. In fact if a UK IW dealer sells to a French customer they are very likely to lose their dealership. IW are incredibly difficult to deal with - note the cost of the COC!.
We have brought a brand new trailer in for a customer (physically driving over to collect it, as we always do) it was a special order, tall one for horses. IW will not supply you (at any price!) a COC for a trailer until it is 6 months old, at which point it is second-hand, so you would not be able to register a new UK sourced trailer for 6 months. You can insure it from the point of collection in the UK, using the unique plate (chassis?) number. We use Axa in France.

If you have priced up IW trailers in France you will know the difference in price.
We find it easier buying second-hand but even that is not easy! We use a UK address and still have farmers holding numbers in the UK, although we have lived in France for over 7 years.

I will try to PM our phone number, this is my husbands specialised subject!

Sue

tramblygoat

Hi,

That sounds incredible that they would do that. Not doubting you but I have yet to hear this from anybody - yet another depressing bit of news. I thought that this sort of protectionism of markets had gone out with European laws. I can always get my dad (who lives in the UK) to buy it but then it would have his name on the sales receipt - grrrr.... Maybe then my dad could then sell it back to me with a new sales invoice? Of course they might then drag their heals when I get back to France - still if it took 6 months of leaving the trailer at the house off road then that's what I would do.

With regard to the insurance the problem seems to be on arrival in France. The only method that seems to be valid is buying, getting the sales invoice and COC (once again you say that they don't want to give you this but I thought they are at least obliged to give you a UK one?) then get a temp carte grise, followed by temp plate and insurance and then return to the UK to actually get the trailer.

I'm still waiting 2 weeks later for the Ifor Williams dealer in France to get back to me with a price so that I can compare. I have little doubt that the price must be much higher as they don't have a price list on the French web site and that isn't by accident.

Now that I know IW are trying to menace customers by this nonsense I am determined not to give Ifor Williams French dealers my money. I support my local shops etc but IW and many others are just greedy.

Thanks for the info.

Mark

south_bound

IMO all this adds to the arguement for keeping a UK registered car to pull the UK plated trailer without any of the hassle being talked about here - not the official way to do it but at some point all this paperwork and running around sets up so many barriers that it becomes too tempting to find an easier route...At the end of the day there is a practical decision to make, and the number of trailers I have seen on French roads with or without number plates, lights, loads overhanging in all directions, bits scraping the ground etc suggests there are worst offenders around than those without the right piece of paper to hand.

L'Acajou

We may have an advantage in having UK driving licences - we have been told by gendarmes that even though all our vehicles are French registered, we can put a UK registration plate on a trailer, (as you would in the UK, which would normally correspond to the towing vehicle,) and we would be legal, or at least it would get round the problem. This came about because the original IW trailer we brought over is in its teens and doesn't qualify for a COC. So if we need to use it on the road, we just stick on a random UK plate ! Sounds mad but that apparently gets round the problem.
Insurance-wise though, I don't know. Is it compulsary in France?
We sold one second-hand trailer and the chap set up the insurance cover before he drove 7 hours to collect it, another didn't bother, just paid, hooked up and off he went!
But, yes, IW are notorious for their inflexibility and terrible relations with Agents and customers. We have priced them up and I think they are 40% dearer in France.

Im_and_Er

I'd be vary cautious about taking the advice of the local Gendarmes, remember a good number of them still think a UK licence has to be exchanged after 12 months! The law is the law and they cannot arbitarily give anyone dispensation from it and whether your licence is a UK one or French makes no odds.

These tricks are all very well whilst everything is going swimmingly, have an accident though, and God forbid maim or kill someone, and in an instant your world turns on it's head

IW won't sell to anybody with a French address ?

How do they determine that I wonder. If you're paying by cash or UK credit card/bank transfer how are they to know that the UK address you give them is not genuine, after all said and done they are only selling you a lump of metal on wheels.

Why the Grrrrr for having your dads name on the receipt, if you think it might be a problem ever heard of Photoshop, do you think anybody in France is going to question it. It's not an official document in a legal sense so no crime is being committed nor are you cheating anybody, just exercising a little pragmatic oiling of the wheels

An interesting topic so do please keep us up to date with any developments.

tramblygoat

I would if I could but my car with towbar is French registered. I quite agree that there is a lot of crap cars/trailers out there but I'm sure to be the one getting caught if I try anything - or the injury/death issue. Clearly the system is a lot of nonsense just for a trailer (yes it's a lump of metal) but then it wouldn't be France if it was easy and admin free.

I even thought that bringing a trailer that was insured with a UK trailer insurance would be okay but apparently that's not okay - even if the trailer has never entered the arms of French admin!

I agree with the comment on buying from IF and that's what I am going to do. IW don't ask for proof of address to buy it's just for the final / not compulsory IW database (which I'll do when my trailer becomes a born again French trailer. I'll buy with UK cheque or UK card and that's the contract made. If IW find out later and spit the dummy then too bad.

40% dearer, how does that not surprise me. Sterling at a low, VAT more in the UK now but the old French dealers do like a lovely margin. Well not from me they won't. They don't even put their price list on the IW France site - wonder why!

I like your attitude I'm and Err. And Photoshop has worked wonders on my work expenses over the year when tight a**ed companies refused to pay out for this and that.

I'll certainly keep you in the picture and I'll get this trailer.....

Tweedpipe

Interesting thread. But cor, what a palaver!
I think I'd be tempted to sell the horses and/or cattle and start breeding shubunkins.......
And of course I'd boycott I.W. aquariums - if they manufactured them.

Domino

I remember only a short while ago a UK tv programme where some Brit made things out of scrap to furnish his house which I am sure was in France

ISTR he made a trailer out of angle iron and box sections
no vin\chassis no etc and don't recall him getting it tested

south_bound

That would work if the total gross weight is below 500kg - no registration needed. In the case of a braked, double axle 1 tonne capacity it is classed as a seperate vehicle and needs to go through the same process as if importing a car, which is why my welded box section on wheels will never be able to get the right paperwork to be officially pulled by a French car!