djuwenda

Hi all, a bit of an odd situation here.

I am a Frenchman born and bred in Brittany, left when I was 20 like so many to go and find work in London
stayed 18 months in London
then 18 months in Paris
18 months in Scotland
3 years in Kettering
bought a narrowboat and spent two years on it in Warwickshire
3 years in Amsterdam and I have now been back for 3 years.


I have one sibling who has now followed me over and lives in Coventry.

where is this all going, I hear you ask?

Well I am starting to worry about the future, both children having flown the nest and settled abroad seems tremendously unfair on my folks and I have started looking at options to go back to France.

I joined a company who expressed an interest into sending me two France in a few years. Long and short of the story is things have gone a bit faster than I expected and the move is now scheduled for October.

Now I may be French, but I live on a narrowboat, hold a camra membership, wear tweed and indulge in binge drinking and casual sex.

I have no idea what lies ahead, other than that I will be in the very fortunate position of having a good job, a flat and a car that will be taken care off for me.

My real worry, is social interaction. Do you expats find it easy to socialise with the French? have you made any genuine lasting friendships?

Also how do wages compare between UK and France? Would converting your UK salary to Euro be the norm or does one need to account for the spectacularly high tax rate over there?

Sorry for the long and slightly rambling post. I am just really nervous at having to leave something I love and exchange it for something I dont know anymore, but remember disliking.

cyrian

Hi
There are many who come onto the forum who cannot speak French; don't have a job and do not have any concept of French bureaucracy or initial difficulties like renting an apartment.
You have none of these problems - so you have a great advantage over many who come to France from the UK.
I have been pleasantly surprised by the French.
They have been quite willing to interact with us (all be it in French) and we have made friends and have been included in social events.
This of course is not Paris.
I have also found the younger generations (<60) to be more sociable and willing to speak English than the older ones (>60).
Also, I have found a greater use of first names and "tu" than I expected.

I have known many french who have lived in the UK and when they returned to France they have been perceived to be Brits who speak very good french because their accents had been modified by speaking English.
I am sure that their accents returned to normal within a short time.

I do not think that you will have anything to worry about.

djuwenda

thanks, in all fairness, I felt a bit of a twonk when I read other people's difficulties in finding work, housing etc. on this board.

on the salary question, would you say equivalent wages between the two countries afford similar lifestyles?

I am just not sure whether I ought to ask for more money given my salary will be lobed by a higher income tax over there. I dont mean to be ar5e over it, I have lost touch with the cost of living in France.

EuroTrash

In my part of France I find the French very honest in their interactions. If they don't like you they won't hide the fact - but it will be for a genuine reason, not because you drive a scruffy car and don't come up to their social standards. They take you as they find you, they don't at all mind if you are 'original' - in fact they seem to like eccentrics - as long as you are not antisocial/disrepectful/dishonest/etc.

Re the wages, I've never seen the point of living in one country and thinking in a different currency. The whole economy is different, your lifestyle will be different. If you compare wages you have to compare everything - price of diesel, price of beer, cotisations, property taxes... and how do you compare in any case - what exchange rate are you going to pick? Plus, when employers and unions and the government negotiate wage levels in France, I don't imagine they check that their settlements are on a par with UK pay structures - pay has to be in line with its country's economy.

However if you really love the UK, why are you considering leaving it?

snoopycat

Having re-read the post I assume for 'family reasons'.

Scots in Treignac

My village has its quota of brits, but there are also a number of Parisiens who spend most of the summer here. These are the peole I meet at the social events and the randonnees.

What did surprise me was when a recently retired teacher told me he was the only non- local at the school who had stayed for more than a few years.

djuwenda

I guess part of the difficulty for me is losing my "foreigner" status, after 15 years...

With regards to income, I think my question quite valid.The cost of living varies greatly between different countries as do wages.

My gut feeling is that taking your UK salary having it converted into Euro will normally means you are normally be slighlty better off when living in France, but I wonder if others have the same view, or different.

And yes, I am moving back for familly reasons, an issue which, broadly speaking, affects mosts expats at some point.

cyrian

I have found that France has changed from a relatively cheap place to a more expensive place since they changed to the euro.
Food has increased a lot in price.
Furniture is either expensive or cheap - it is difficult to find middle-priced furniture.
Electrical goods are more expensive.
Mobile phones are more expensive.
A lot of these higher prices are due to the lack of competition with respect to the UK. i.e. the restrictions on "sales" in France.
However, I think that things are changing.
There is a reduction in the smaller shops that have been traditional in France (perhaps not in villages) and an increase in hypermarkets and national chains. These larger stores want to compete on price and there are now more promotions e.g. 3-day "events" (read "sale") and special reductions with the "carte maison".
Hypermarkets have their budget ranges in food and clothes which is making life for the market stalls and boulanger more difficult.
The cost of living depends on how you live and what you want to spend money on.
You will not find a dramatic difference if you have a good standard of living in the UK but there seem to be lots of French at the lower end of the pay scale who are struggling to make ends meet.

djuwenda

thats roughly in line with what I was othinking to be honest.

I remember French taxes being crippling and my surprise the first time I got a paycheck in England... most of the money I had earnt was still with me!

I probably need a chat with an advisor at this stage to navigate the complex French system.

oh joy.

Scots in Treignac

I suppose it depends how long you have been associated with France.
In !958, I had a family holiday in France Youth hostelling. We kids enjoyed eating grapes and Pate all the time, but my parents were struggling to feed us.
Due to mistake at the bank an 18 day holiday which was budgeted for £70 (the same as a 2 week family holiday in a hotel in Cornwall), only cost £40.

When I travelled back and forth on my own in the sixties, it was the high cost of the channel crossing that hurt the most. A cup of coffee was a bit more expensive, but it was like comparing apples and pears.

I took my own chlidren to France in 1993 and I had a near rebellion on my hands when I refused to buy cakes at the nearest shop. I did find a Routier with a five course lunch at 5 euros.

Five years later the exchanged rate had changed a great deal, and my children were taken aback at my extravagance.

Then in 2007, the pendulum started to swing back.

I blame the British currency cycles - not the French.

djuwenda

well, I was borm in 79, left France in 99 so coming to 15 years of expatriation.
Yes when I left, £1 was 10 Francs, life was noticeably more expensive in the UK, but in a strange way, and because the UK tax system seems more of a PAYG set up, I didnt mind. The fact that I discovered the London nightlife at the same time was no doubt a sweetener.

I think France is probably still cheaper, especially if you have the patience to put pen to forms, shop wisely for a big familly and your health is less than pefect. In a way I have always felt that England was the place to work and play and France the place to retire and relax and or raise a familly.

cyrian

I agree that currency fluctuations make comparisons a bit of a nonsense in price comparisons. I usually compare at €1.10-ish and €1.50-ish to allow for that.
However, when you compare new products where the price should reflect the current exchange rates (assuming that the original currency is the $ or the yen) then many non-food items are still expensive.
The prices for TVs or other household goods are the same in all the shops - there is no price difference.
Golf equipment is considerably more expensive as is photographic equipment because there are few retailers to choose from.
The french people I know certainly complain about the costs since the introduction of the euro - and they can't blame the £ for that.
I think that the rate of exchange is certainly a factor but you cannot ignore the higher prices in french shops.
The only way the OP can compare the costs is to take the current exchange rate into consideration.
At the end-of-the-day it all depends on what you buy - i.e.how the costs stack up for you.

cardi

Your biggest problem is going to be how deal with the bureaucracy and officialdom. You were young when you left and maybe did not have too many dealings with it but after living abroad you may find it difficult to accept. Many French returnees have this problem.
I'm sure you know this.