JimmyZA

Hi

I'm hoping someone here can point me in the right direction.

My wife & I live in South Africa and are both British Citizens by descent (we both have British parents, but were born in South Africa). We both have British passports.

Our children (aged 1 & 3) are South African born (and have South African passports).

I am going to Northern Ireland later this year to study for a year and want to take the family along too. What sort of visa do I need for my kids?

- Tourist visa requires gives them a maximum stay of 6 months, but we're there for a year.
- Family of Settled Person - Looks like it would work, but is very expensive
- EEA Family Permit - Looks like this is applicable for EU citizens but not UK citizens
- Any other options?

Thanks so much for your input!

poida

If either parent (you or your wife) has lived in the UK for at least 3 continuous years in the past then your children can be registered as British Citizens under Section 3(2) and they can then apply for UK passports.

If not I think the settled visa is the only option. They wouldn't be eligible for Ancestry Visa until they are 18.

JimmyZA

Thanks poida!

Neither of us have spent that much continuous time in the UK unfortunately.

Would it be an option to get a 6 month tourist visa & then get them a residence card based on our residence status?

Alternatively would they be eligable for a dependent of a student (dependent of tier 4 visa)?

Seems crazy that it's more expensive for us to get a visa than it would be if we were EU citizens...

poida

I'm sure someone will correct me if I'm wrong, but from what I understand there would first need to be a visa holder to be able to apply as a dependent of a visa holder, and I don't think they would (knowingly) issue a visa to a British Citizen.

You may also struggle to get them a tourist visa if they suspect you will be staying longer than 6 months.

There may be a loophole in that South African citizens don't require a visa for Ireland and they would be allowed to travel within the Common Travel Area, but they wouldn't be allowed in mainland UK without a visa and they would of course have to adhere to the Irish immigration conditions. So if you are looking to fly to Ireland first and travel to NI by road that might buy you some time.

SanDiegogirl

You can't switch to any other visa or 'resident card' from visitor status.

if you are on Tier 4 visa, obtain Tier 4 dependent visas for the children.

BritInParis

Were any of your parents in Crown service (British government or military) at the time of your births?

If not then the only options for your children are registration as a British citizens or settlement visas. Since neither of you have spent the requisite three years in the UK prior to your children's birth then settlement visas are your only option. As children of British citizens they'll be given Indefinite Leave to Enter meaning you can register them as British citizens (otherwise than by descent) after you have spent three years all together in the UK.

JimmyZA

SanDiegogirl - thanks for the warning about being unable to switch visas. I don't need a study visa as I'm a British citizen. I was hoping our kids might be able to get a 'dependent of student' visa without me having such a visa.

BritInParis - no, no Crown Service for either my or my wife's parents. We're only intending to stay for 1 year while I study.

poida - I'd like to hear more of your thoughts on the Ireland option - we are planning to fly in to Dublin (where my course is), and then move to Northern Ireland (where we can actually afford the rent )

poida

It's just a hypothetical and in practice I wouldn't necessarily recommend it.

Some 'tourists' do get caught out; Be wary of visa restrictions when crossing the border - Border People

As BritInParis said it looks like a settlement visa for the children is the best option. And if you do decide to live in the UK for 3 years you can register them as British Citizens before they turn 18, I'm sure they will thank you for it later!

BritInParis

If the course is in Dublin then why not simply live in a cheaper part of the RoI since you intend to commute anyway? Unlike the UK South African citizens do not require a visa to visit the RoI and your children could then apply for a Stamp 4 to permit them to remain with you under EEA Freedom of Movement rules until such time as you have completed your studies. Far easier than trying to move to NI if you only intend to be there for a year.

JimmyZA

We've been considering that too, but don't know RoI at all, so don't know where to start looking for a place in our budget, thats not completely rural. Also, we were hoping to have some NHS support as a backup in case we need it, which we wouldnt have in RoI, but would in NI (as far as I can tell).

BritInParis

In NI, certainly. In the RoI there is a slightly different set-up in terms of provision of healthcare but as British citizens and their dependants ordinarily resident in the RoI my understanding is that your family would be entitled to public healthcare.

Entitlement to health services

JimmyZA

From what I can see, NI would cover hospital visits, but not GP's which can be quite expensive from what I understand. Whereas NHS does include GP visits, right?

Do you know any details about registering with the NHS once we get to NI?

BritInParis

Slightly confused about what you're trying to say there. All NHS services, including GP and hospitals, are free of charge for UK residents. Unlike England there are no prescription charges in Northern Ireland.

You should register with a GP when you first arrive. You'll be given a NHS number if you don't already have one.

JimmyZA

Sorry my mistake, I meant RoI would cover hospital, but not GP.

BritInParis

Ah, I see. Quite possibly, I can't say I'm particularly au fait with the Irish healthcare system, but I'm willing to bet a couple of potential GP appointments over the course of one year won't cost you as much as two UK settlement visas for your children since they're currently ZAR 26,352 a pop.