bushcoexpat

Many thanks DaveLovesDee. The application has got some difficult questions, such as; for how long do intend to stay in the UK

bushcoexpat

Many thanks DaveLovesDee. Shall we put for those silly questions, that we intend to stay in the UK permanantely

DaveLovesDee

Indefinite is the word we used.

bushcoexpat

I really appreciate your responses Dave

Fair Lady

I am sure I read somewhere that even if the UK does pull out of the EU, that those in the midst of the SS route will not be affected? Is this correct? It would be awful to be so close and then find yourself now stuck and unable to complete the SS route!

BritInParis

Not unless the UK also pulls out of the EEA.

DaveLovesDee

Pretty much! And the EEA countries are subject to the same EU laws as EU member states, without the ability of the latter to be involved in the drafting of those laws.

So if the UK were to leave the EU and remain in the EEA, they'd actually be worse of as the UK would have no influence in EU regulations.

Were the UK to withdraw from both the EU and the EEA, the UK would have to renegotiate trade agreements with the EU, which would likely be to the disadvantage of the UK.

not2old

Dave when you arrived in Malta I believe you registered self-employed, or did you manage to find employment?

I know Angela V that went the SS from South Africa through Ireland to the UK, went/registered self-employed in Ireland.

Is it better to go the register as self employed than to try to find work and if so, do you actually have to earn an income for the several months before getting the family permit to the UK?

DaveLovesDee

I started employment within 4 weeks.

I believe so.

As self-employed, I believe the object would be to show income and outgoings in the form of invoices and bank statements. Businesses tend to rarely become profitable inside the first 6 months, so you're basically just showing that the business is actually trading (as opposed to being just a name.

not2old

for information purposes only, not to taken as legal advice, as follows

I think the family permit route may no longer requiring persons to do the double step. Simply exercise your rights under EU law to move with your non EU spouse to another member state for a short period, then with having a residence card, move to the UK unrestricted without applying for the family permit which the UK have been so insistent on.

Going through Ireland, Spain Malta once persons have a residence card of that member state can now move to the UK

Non-EU family members do not need visa to enter UK, says European court | UK news | The Guardian

BBC News - European court gives UK visa direction

extract c&p'd from an article & the ruling

"the EU Court of Justice handed down an important ruling that held that Member States are, in principle, required to recognise a residence card issued under Article 10 of Directive 2004/38, for the purposes of entry into their territory without a visa.

The EU Court of Justice s ruling in case C-202/13 McCarthy specifically held that the UK authorities were in breach of Directive 2004/38 by requiring family members of EU citizens to obtain an EEA Family Permit even though they held a residence card and wished to travel to the UK with their EU or join them there.

This principle also applies to the family members a British citizen returning home after having resided together in another EU Member State.

As a result, the UK should now be recognising EU family member residence cards issued by other Member States and should not be requiring them to apply for an EEA Family Permit in order to travel to the UK. This would include any European residence card.

As a result, the Home Office – including both UK Visas and Immigration and Border Force – are under a legal obligation to allow entry to the UK to family members of an EU citizen who hold a residence card issued by other EU countries, provided this residence card identifies them as the family member of an EU citizen.

This legal obligation takes immediate effect and does not depend upon the date of issue of the family member s residence card.

This legal obligation also applies to family members a British citizen returning home after having resided together in another EU Member State, when they hold a residence card identifying them as the family member of an EU citizen."

not2old

related to post #400, again for information purposes only

I shall post this next bit to the Malta thread & Dave you'd understand what I'm posting

1. The Brit with their non EU spouse arrives in a member state (Malta for this purpose)

2. The Brit (with spouse in tow) can exercise the reciprocal agreement between Malta & the UK to obtain a Maltese health card. You & your spouse (Brit first, spouse after Brit has theirs)cannot be refused & it is not required to have residence card first, thus by-passing the need to have private health insurance

https://ehealth.gov.mt/HealthPortal/...e_maltauk.aspx

3. That done, they're on the way to getting the e-residence card. For Malta its requires either to be employed, self employed or self -sufficient.

The two best options are to gain employment, or self sufficient IMO

For self sufficient, Malta requires a couple show 23,000 euro of capital or approx 100 euro/wk income from a source, that can be investments, bank interest bonds, pensions. The funds do not have to be on deposit in Malta. The requirement is proof the funds exist certified in English.

For the self sufficient, 23,000 euo is a lot less than the 62,500GBP

Both the Brit (EU national) and the non EU spouse together get their e-residence cards at the same time

http://iip.gov.mt/wp-content/uploads...U-National.pdf

3. Dont forget to get a tax number from the Maltese inland revenue

4. All set.The RHA Health card which meant no requirement to have health insurance, the e-residence card

There would be nothing stopping the Brit & the family member from entering the UK, according to what I found & posted in post#400

The above I'm guessing could be applied to those that go through Ireland or other member states

not2old

dated 20 January 2015 is a response from the home office UK Visa & Immigration section*

http://www.scribd.com/doc/253276166/...se-to-McCarthy

*source: BritCits

feelbritish

If that happens and it is so easy for spouses then to arrive in UK, I imagine the UKBA and Home Office would definitely have to review the spouse visas if they want a certain amount of control!

not2old

my guess is all those changes they made back in 2012 was to stop the shams & scams, imposing the tough financial burden on the genuine cases.

Unfortunately EU law prevails and as it is up until now, its a two step approach through a member state then to the UK without the financial burden.

After this ruling in the McCarty case, one could go from the US or a commonwealth country with their spouse to be in a member state exercising their treaty rights, get the residence card & be in the UK within a month, with little cost and a lot less hassle

Its a test as well as a wait & see... only time will tell

not2old

Updating the information

http://curia.europa.eu/jcms/upload/d...cp140182en.pdf

http://www.scribd.com/doc/253276166/...se-to-McCarthy

Discussion, I'm now thinking outside the box & anyone that has gone this route or who has any expertise, I invite you to discuss and/or to respond with facts.

step 1: Non EU spouse exercising the treaty rights living in a member state (centre of life is outside the UK) get their 'Residence card' while living in that member state.

2. Leaving the member state together, they enter the UK (Brit with non EU spouse) without a family permit, the spouse has just a foreign passport + the EU residence card [lets say from Spain] as in the McCarthy case

My question....

3. Now in the UK, can the non EU spouse with the residence card from a member state now apply for the UK residence card without the family permit? If not, why?

4. Can they with just the EU residence card from the member state (plus supporting documents) & without the UK residence card obtain a UK NI number & NHS card - on the basis they'd be settled in the UK living with their UK spouse?

5. If 3 & 4 are not likely, then can the non EU spouse with the residence card from the member state shortly after their arrival in the UK (with the Brit spouse) are they now rightfully allowed to apply for a UK family permit from within the UK?