arranging a doctor for my US children

Old Sep 21st 2012, 9:05 pm
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Default Re: arranging a doctor for my US children

Originally Posted by formula
That changes on 7 January 2013 ...
I think Child Benefit will be phased out in the not too distant future and be replaced by Universal Credit and all the conditions that imposes on welfare claimants. There is still another 10 billion pounds to be cut from the welfare bill, according to leaks! ...
It's amazing how times change and hopefully this will be reversed after the next general election.
The whole point of Family Allowance (as it then was when introduced by the Attlee government) is that it was paid to mothers, not fathers (unless the mother was deceased) and was not means tested. This ensured that there was weekly money to buy the children some food, even if the father was an alcoholic always in the pub. Not means tested implied that the mother did not have to obtain the father's cooperation in order to collect Family Allowance.

Anyway, if the OP is living in England with her resident children she should apply for child benefit. Citizenship is not at issue, only residence.
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Old Sep 21st 2012, 9:35 pm
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Default Re: arranging a doctor for my US children

Originally Posted by holly_1948
It's amazing how times change and hopefully this will be reversed after the next general election.
The whole point of Family Allowance (as it then was when introduced by the Attlee government) is that it was paid to mothers, not fathers (unless the mother was deceased) and was not means tested. This ensured that there was weekly money to buy the children some food, even if the father was an alcoholic always in the pub. Not means tested implied that the mother did not have to obtain the father's cooperation in order to collect Family Allowance.
I don't understand this concept. Surely if one wants to procreate you should have the funds to be able to feed your child. I think it should be means tested, why should top earners still be entitled to benefits? Why should people who can afford to support their kids STILL get benefits? If you can afford kids then have them, if not then don't have them or wait until you are financially stable. That's the problem with the UK - too many handouts hence this problem:

http://www.express.co.uk/posts/view/...ts-in-3-weeks-
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Old Sep 21st 2012, 9:47 pm
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Default Re: arranging a doctor for my US children

Originally Posted by Pom_Chch
I don't understand this concept. Surely if one wants to procreate you should have the funds to be able to feed your child. I think it should be means tested, why should top earners still be entitled to benefits? Why should people who can afford to support their kids STILL get benefits? If you can afford kids then have them, if not then don't have them or wait until you are financially stable. That's the problem with the UK - too many handouts hence this problem: http://www.express.co.uk/...
Opinions certainly vary on this.

The question was put a long time ago when a, now famous and arguably deceased, person who went by Cain said "Am I my brother's keeper?". (Genesis 4:9 KJV) Everyone who answers that question honestly says a lot about themselves.

As to family allowance, an intention was that in a situation of a wealthy husband who kept his wife and children short of money, they would get at least some money from the State (which would then be taken back from the husband as income tax).

Last edited by holly_1948; Sep 21st 2012 at 9:56 pm.
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Old Sep 21st 2012, 9:48 pm
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Default Re: arranging a doctor for my US children

Originally Posted by Pom_Chch
I don't understand this concept. Surely if one wants to procreate you should have the funds to be able to feed your child. I think it should be means tested, why should top earners still be entitled to benefits? Why should people who can afford to support their kids STILL get benefits? If you can afford kids then have them, if not then don't have them or wait until you are financially stable. That's the problem with the UK - too many handouts hence this problem:

http://www.express.co.uk/posts/view/...ts-in-3-weeks-
I agree - why should I subsidize people having children when the country is overpopulated? We should be rewarding singlehood and celibacy!
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Old Sep 21st 2012, 10:14 pm
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Default Re: arranging a doctor for my US children

Not to take this thread further off topic than it already has, but I guess I misunderstand what child benefit is. I thought it was basically the same thing as the deductions one gets off their tax liability for children here in the US. I thought this seemed fair, since it one has to spend more money once they have kids.
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Old Sep 21st 2012, 10:51 pm
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Default Re: arranging a doctor for my US children

Originally Posted by Bluegrass Lass
Not to take this thread further off topic than it already has, but I guess I misunderstand what child benefit is. I thought it was basically the same thing as the deductions one gets off their tax liability for children here in the US. I thought this seemed fair, since it one has to spend more money once they have kids.
Historically, Family Allowance (later renamed) was an attempt to lessen post-war child hunger.

Mostly, Wages were paid in cash to husbands on Thursday evenings.
Mostly.
Family Allowance was paid in cash to mothers on Tuesday mornings at a time of the week the need for money to buy food was typically greatest.

Not means testing the benefit was seen as a way to reduce bureaucracy to help those too poor and oppressed to cope with bureaucracy. And in any case the money would be clawed back in transaction in the case of wealthy families.
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Old Sep 22nd 2012, 2:28 am
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Default Re: arranging a doctor for my US children

Originally Posted by formula
Many places take a passport as proof. When I changed my name, I applied for a new UK passport first and then it was easy to change everything else.

In the OPs case; her children are born abroad, only have US passports and entered the UK as American visitors. It's not up to the GPs office to know immigration laws and whether a child is allowed British citizenship or not. It is for the applicant to show this proof. A UK passport is the easiest way.
My point is, since the OP apparently has the necessary proof to get a passport for the child, she has proof of citizenship.(essentially the same proof that any newborn in UK would have). The fact that the doctors' receptionist does not recognize it is irrelevant. The child is not "allowed" citizenship, she/he HAS citizenship, passport or not.

The passport does not prove residency, which is the actual condition for free NHS care. As you mentioned, immigration laws are not the concern of NHS.
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Old Sep 22nd 2012, 8:56 am
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Default Re: arranging a doctor for my US children

Originally Posted by dunroving
I agree - why should I subsidize people having children when the country is overpopulated? We should be rewarding singlehood and celibacy!


If you're short of a few bob just have a couple of kids, that's what you seem to get paid for in the UK nowadays! I believe there is a "milk allowance" too. I mean really? If you can't afford milk for your baby my guess is you shouldn't be having them!
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Old Sep 22nd 2012, 9:27 am
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Default Re: arranging a doctor for my US children

Originally Posted by holly_1948
It's amazing how times change and hopefully this will be reversed after the next general election.
I doubt it. Labour are the ones who started most of these welfare changes by awarding contracts to private companies to get the lazy back to work i.e ATOS and the back to work contracts to lots of firms. During their watch, for the first time ever, the welfare bill exceeded the income tax the government receive. Labour realised too many healthy adults were either claiming to be too ill to work or were breeding and using those children to avoid working. Too many children are bred to become a means to an end for their "parents". Labour have already said that they too will be continuing these cuts (well they started them, so I can see why they will) and immigration cuts. Even hinting that if they get in, they will give the country the EU in/out, vote.

Save the Children have already pointed out that many UK children don't get a hot meal or new shoes, yet their parents are given thousands every year to keep them. Hence why all the changes are going to come in and more help aimed at help going directly to the children and not cash in the parents hands. All parents will now be forced to do more to keep their children or work for their benefits.

Until recently, 2 healthy parents only had to do 24 hours work between them to get their income made up to a wage, by the taxpayer. This has now changed and when Universal Credit comes in, parents will have to earn a set amount per week or will be reporting to the job centre to show their job searching efforts and then they will work for their benefits to pay society back for keeping them and their children. The days of sitting at home, filling a form in once a year and watching the money roll into their bank account, is ending, and neither main party will restore that.


Originally Posted by holly_1948
The whole point of Family Allowance (as it then was when introduced by the Attlee government) is that it was paid to mothers, not fathers (unless the mother was deceased) and was not means tested. This ensured that there was weekly money to buy the children some food, even if the father was an alcoholic always in the pub. Not means tested implied that the mother did not have to obtain the father's cooperation in order to collect Family Allowance.
Thats a bit of a gender bias. Do you think that women don't spend their childs welfare on their alcohol? My friends next door neighbour is a healthy single mother welfare claimer, who doesn't work and she goes out every night spending her childrens welfare payments and sits in the garden during the day, drinking bottles of wine.. Her son recently lost his brace and she was told she would have to pay for the next one. She didn't buy another one for him, despite getting close to £400 a week in welfare payments. There are good mothers and bad mothers, and it is the same with fathers and more will be done in the near future to ensure that welfare gets to their children i.e. food vouchers and special clubs to feed and clothe the children.

Atlee would be turning in his grave if he saw the 66(?) welfare payments the UK has and how many people (especailly parents) abuse the system and then don't feed their children with the welfare money they are given. See the Save the Children comment above. Child Benefit can be paid to either parent: mothers work too, or the mother may be the sole earner.

Originally Posted by holly_1948
Anyway, if the OP is living in England with her resident children she should apply for child benefit. Citizenship is not at issue, only residence.
Citizenship and residency are both issues, if she wants free healthcare for her children and she will have to take the proof they require. It's not an issue if she is going to pay for their healthcare. The choice is the parents to make.

Last edited by formula; Sep 22nd 2012 at 9:30 am.
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Old Sep 22nd 2012, 9:34 am
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Default Re: arranging a doctor for my US children

Originally Posted by RICH
My point is, since the OP apparently has the necessary proof to get a passport for the child, she has proof of citizenship.(essentially the same proof that any newborn in UK would have). The fact that the doctors' receptionist does not recognize it is irrelevant.
It's only irrelevant if she is going to pay for her childs healthcare.
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Old Sep 22nd 2012, 9:35 am
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Default Re: arranging a doctor for my US children

Originally Posted by dunroving
We should be rewarding singlehood and celibacy!
How would they check that
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Old Sep 22nd 2012, 10:03 am
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Default Re: arranging a doctor for my US children

Originally Posted by formula
Thats a bit of a gender bias. Do you think that women don't spend their childs welfare on their alcohol?
Agree with this statement. It's bias and outdated on so many levels. Mums work just as much as dads nowadays, so the whole "mum's left with no money because dad's drinking it away in the pub" just doesn't stack up any more. Women are much more financially independent now, gone are the days where we sit at home tending to the house and kids!
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Old Sep 22nd 2012, 10:04 am
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Default Re: arranging a doctor for my US children

Originally Posted by Bluegrass Lass
Not to take this thread further off topic than it already has, but I guess I misunderstand what child benefit is. I thought it was basically the same thing as the deductions one gets off their tax liability for children here in the US. I thought this seemed fair, since it one has to spend more money once they have kids.
The following are some of the welfare payments that parents can claim:-

Child Benefit is/was something that every parent gets for every child they have, regardless of if they work of not. The more children they have, the more child benefit they get paid.

Then we also have Child Tax Credits, again extra is paid for every child regardless if you work or not. In fact, the more you work, the less Child Tax Credits you get.

Then there is Working Tax Credits, again the less you work the more you will get. Singles and childless couples have to work a full week to get WTC and they have to be on a very basic wage; but a couple of healthy parents, only have to work 24 hours a week between them, to get this add on.

Plus there are all sorts of other things parents who don't work/do very little work, get. Like an extra room (bigger house) for every child they have over a certain age and they could choose where in the country they wanted to live i.e. expensive areas of London and the welfare state paid their rent and council tax and free school meals and gave them extra cash in hand, for every child they had.

Both parents who work, get help towards their childcare costs, but as you can see from above, many would rather not work or do very little work as it "affects me tax credits". They do what is called "maximising their benefits" which is working out how they can do the least work for the most welfare. Or one parent works while the other stays at home while the chidren are at school and the state pays their lost wage.

Of course we have the others who claim to work 30 hours a week selling on ebay, but only make £5 a week and the welfare state makes this up in Working Tax Credits. HMRC (who pay tax credits) have now jumped on these people and many are having to pay back overpayments.

Now the welfare bill is too high for the country to afford, there are welfare cuts; but those who are really ill, will get more money and help. They have managed to give more to those people too sick to work and the disabled, by the Labour government bringing in medicals for those who claim to be too ill to work (but not all are required to have medicals). The fraudsters (some 60% of failed medicals so far) have had their sick welfare payments removed and this has been given as extra to those who really are ill. Those who claimed to be too ill to work, got a lot more welfare than those who are job seekers.

With 66 welfare payments, the UK was known as "Benefits Britain" and attracted the wrong sort. Now that is coming to an end; some changes came in last year, several more very big welfare changes in 2013 starting in Janaury with Child Benefit and Council Tax Benefit (everyone now having to pay something towards council tax if they are between 16 and 61; soon to be 66). Then another 10 billion of welfare cuts to make and the stopping of making it so attractive for parents to use their children to get welfare. I think Germany will be the most generous welfare country then; so good luck Germany.

Last edited by formula; Sep 22nd 2012 at 10:21 am.
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Old Sep 22nd 2012, 10:12 am
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Default Re: arranging a doctor for my US children

Originally Posted by Pom_Chch
Agree with this statement. It's bias and outdated on so many levels. Mums work just as much as dads nowadays, so the whole "mum's left with no money because dad's drinking it away in the pub" just doesn't stack up any more. Women are much more financially independent now, gone are the days where we sit at home tending to the house and kids!
Stick your tin hat on; there seem to be some of those "don't work, even though the children are at school all day" mothers on here

Like you, I can't see why women want to remain on the ark.
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Old Sep 22nd 2012, 10:17 am
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Default Re: arranging a doctor for my US children

Originally Posted by formula
Stick your tin hat on; there seem to be some of those "don't work, even though the children are at school all day" mothers on here
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