Pombat

We recently moved back from the US and had to show proof of identity (passports for all ) and proof of residency in order to be eligible for free NHS care. We had letters offering our children places at school, and those were acceptable, along with our moving receipts to prove that we had indeed moved everything!

Pom_Chch

Interesting article to back up previous comments:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/health/ar...treatment.html

dunroving

As Mr Spock would say, this situation is "highly illogical" - they apparently have accepted that the mother is resident but not the children. You are missing the point. Either all are resident or none are resident - other than the highly unlikely scenario that you have described (mother lives in the UK, children live in the US with the father), why should they go to all the trouble and taxpayer expense of strictly pursuing this highly unlikely scenario? There are much bigger fish to fry. The cost-benefit ratio of going through this rigmarole makes no logical sense. What a waste of resources.

And when you consider the number of expats who overtly (and complicitly) take NHS health care from their former GP when they pop home for the summer, I just find this particular case too heavy-handed and bureaucratic - if it is as the OP has presented it (they are happy to register her as resident but not her children).

I think the overall issue of NHS health tourism (that probably none of us would contest, and I have supported in several previous threads on the topic, if people would bother to go back and read them rather than rehashing) is getting conflated with the particular case in this situation, that just seems over the top.

Hopefully the OP will at some point come back and clarify whether this is actually the case.

Bluegrass Lass

A passport would prove they are UKC's, but it wouldn't prove residency. And we are assuming the kids are school-age, which they may not be. So what would she do then?

When UK parents move within the UK, what do they show as proof of residence for their kids? Do they have to show the surgery passports, or simply provide mail or a lease that shows the parents' new address and then the surgery assumes the kids live with the parents?

formula

I agree with all this.

At the moment, illegals are allowed to have their children at school; but they are not allowed free NHS. Visitors can't have their children at school or free NHS. Schools can still be very lax at checking but NHS staff have sharpened up.

I assume the children entered the UK border and were declared as visitors to the UK and stamped in as such on their US passports? Visitors are not allowed free NHS.

I assume the OP will have to:-

• prove the children are her children
• prove the children are British (and therefore don't need a visa) as not all Brits have British children i.e. those Brits by descent who have children born abroad.
• provide evidence that the children have permission to live with her in the UK if she is separated from their father
• prove that the children now reside in the UK and are not just here on a visit from the US (as I assume the OP had them enter the UK border as visitors?)

What evidence did the surgery ask for? Perhaps you could pay for their treatment until you are able to get the proof required and then claim the money back?

The NHS are now checking those who are trying to use the NHS for free when they aren't allowed it and are also checking and billing, those who have used the NHS in the past when they weren't allowed it as they didn't reside in the UK. Many people (including Brits) are reporting getting NHS bills through the post for past treatment and some are reporting having spouse visas refused as they have an outstanding NHS bill.

I was working away and had to go to an NHS drop in centre. The staff checked everyone and if they just gave a doctors name and addrees, the staff checked further to see that they still reside in the UK. As there was a 3 hour wait, I saw that 2 people were told they could not have free NHS. One was a non-EU who could not provide a valid visa despite him shouting "I pay taxes in the UK" and the other was a Brit who said she would go home to get the documents to prove she lived in the UK and would be back in 5 minutes, but she never returned.

UK taxpayers are glad to see the NHS are taking this stance. It's not about being a "jobsworth" but is all about stopping the abuse of the NHS. The staff just want to see the proof that the children are allowed to have free NHS.

Pom_Chch

All I will say is that I have worked for the NHS and you would be surprised at the lengths people go through to have access to our free services. I've seen patients who claim to be living in the UK and paying taxes but can barely speak a word of English, literally cannot even say "hello, thank you, please, goodbye." Usually they turn up with a family member who is a UK resident and they do all the interpreting. I know it's a hassle to prove who you and your family are and where you are from I am glad it's happening. Hopefully long gone are the days where foreigners come into the UK, use our services and then return home.

I'm sorry but the OP cannot expect to rock up in England after living in the States for 13 years, register at a surgery and straight away have access to free treatment for her and her kids without proving anything. Just because you are from the UK originally it doesn't mean you should still be entitled to the privileges that the UK has, especially if you haven't worked here for some time. From what it sounds the OP doesn't have this mindset at all but some of the other people posting do!

holly_1948

As a next-year-to-be-returning Brit, I find no problem at all the the NHS reasonably requires proof of residency. The problem is that there is no guidance as to what this proof needs to be.

Most older people, like me (I will have been away almost 30 years after a 15 year working life in Britain) will stay with relatives initially and have few bills. It takes time to buy or rent a house, especially since most rentals are unavailable to long ago homeowners who have no history of renting anywhere.

It must be especially difficult for a child who is a new resident. A child will typically not have electricity bills in his or her own name or so the like. Like I say, the problem is not procuring information, the problem is not knowing what is acceptable and what is not acceptable (other than things that only people who have been resident for a long time would have, such as months of bills).

For example, would a affidavit from a JP or solicitor be enough? I could easily get that. Or how about a mailed statement from the DWP (Department for Work and Pensions), would that be enough? Registration as a UK based student with Open University? A UK driving licence?
Who knows? It seems like a complete lottery. All the more annoying for someone who just seeks a few routine pharmaceuticals that are cheaper on the open market than at NHS prescription charge prices. I guess the answer is to bring a few years supply of needed medications with me and risk some jobsworth objecting to even that.

Pom_Chch

Guidance on what proof is required can be found here:

http://www.nhs.uk/chq/Pages/1095.asp...CategoryID=158

If people are not sure on what is accepted then call or email the surgery to check. Generally most surgeries adhere to the same policy what is and isn't accepted as proof. The reason it seems like a complete lottery is because so many people are in different situations and different rules can apply. Some are returning expats coming back to the UK after various amounts of time abroad, some are British people just moving house, some have kids etc.

Yes I must say it is difficult to prove if you have just arrived but unfortunately that is the price you pay for other people abusing the system. It's not technically the NHS's fault, they are only trying to protect an already strained system from being abused by people who seek free services with the intention of never paying it back.

As for children proof of schooling or nursery is widely accepted. For kids it's not about proving an address as such, but more about proving that they are staying in the UK for a prolonged period of time.

As for adults just landing in the UK with no fixed address, no bills etc some surgeries will accept paperwork such as shipping receipts. As for a DWP letter I would imagine this would be OK if you explained why you do not have any other bills in your name. You would have to check with the surgery you intend to register at. You may be pleasantly surprised and it turns out to not be very much hassle in the end!

Pistolpete2

Actually, this is a little closer to the mark for new arrivals:

http://www.nhs.uk/chq/Pages/1087.asp...CategoryID=162

Indeed, for holly_1948, shipping receipts is the only viable "proof" of intention to stay in the UK to prove entitlement as none of the other five work for her:

"receipts showing shipping of goods to the UK"

Pom_Chch

holly_1948

It sounds like I may have to ship some goods, even though I have no need of doing so. My plan was to give everything to my kids. Including my collection of antique Lee-Enfield rifles of types that my ancestors carried in the Boer war and through France in both World wars; ironically now unwelcome in the UK and preserved in working order by collectors in the USA!

It takes "forever" to sell a house of course, not uncommonly a year or more.
I wonder if applying to benefits (winter fuel allowance?) counts enough. I'll let you all know if I find out.

Which is the issue, it's not that one objects to particular requirements, it's that there seems to be no uniform policy and the cited requirements are as clear as mud. (What constitutes "selling goods" for example, selling a used car perhaps?).

Silly me, on second thoughts, instead of giving my belongings to my kids, I can sell them to them at peppercorn prices. Problem solved.

Property Seen Relocation

Hi Lucy Love

I come up against this all the time at work. Basically all you have to do is confirm to the practice that the children are planning to be resident for at least 6 months. So there are various ways of doing this. I have put them in order of what works best for us.

1) School registration
2) Tenancy agreement - under 18 they do not need to be mentioned but some agents will put children on as occupants
3) Letter from employer, showing that the family has been moved
4) There visa application

If all the above does not work, ultimately any person in the UK, visitor or not is entitled to emergency assistance ie A+E or some / most practices offer emergency visitor appointments.

If you just want them to get a health check and cannot provide any of the above, just wait for the visa - it should be with you soon, if you processed it straight away and there is not someone contesting it.

Hope this helps

dunroving

I think we may have scared the OP off with all the back and forth and conflicting opinions.

I hope not.

LucyLove: Just read post #24 and ignore the rest. It has all you need to know. The rest is just opinion and "lively debate".

Pom_Chch

There is a uniform policy. When you return to the UK from abroad and wish to sign up to a doctors surgery you must prove that you intend to stay in the UK. By doing this you must produce certain documents stated on the list. The link has everything on there that you need to provide and this will apply in all NHS surgeries. I don't understand how this would be construed as being anything but clear. There is nothing on the list about proof of selling goods, it's about shipping goods.

Dunroving - yep, consider the thread hijacked. Sorry lucylove!

holly_1948

And just about none of those are reasonable to ask for from children. They all (even having children who attend school) apply to adults.

I suppose anyone, even a child, can apply for benefits, even if there is no material basis for an application.