GulliesPacific

Hi guys,

I'm hopefully on the verge of a job offer in Hong Kong and will look at moving out there in a few months. Nothing's certain at this point, but fingers are crossed.

I ideally want to live in the Causeway Bay or Wan Chai areas as I've been there many, many times... However, from what I've seen of prices, they're HIGH. Very high. About £2.5k a month ($28k) for a one or two bedroomed place.

Is this just HK or have I picked the most expensive of areas?

The job is with a well known, global travel consultancy firm. I don't know yet what they pay as a base, but I do know commissions are uncapped. Potential is there to make good money.

It's a huge move, of course, so I'm trying to get some info before I take the plunge - if at all.

Thanks so much

penguinsix

CWB and Wanchai are not the highest, as much as it might be shocking you right now. Not by a long stretch.

Take a look at these sites:

http://www.gohome.com.hk
http://www.squarefoot.com.hk/

It all depends what you want and where you want to live. You can find cheaper on the island (look at Kennedy Town for example) or you can cross over and head up into the New Territories and save considerable coin. Kowloon has a lot of new developments around the Elements and Olympic that might be a tad cheaper (or not). You can get a slightly older and bigger place or go for modern and a bit smaller.

We pay $52k HKD for a small 3br and we're in the cheapest building on our street. The neighbors, who I can see out my window, are paying $110k a month for their places and have to look at me.

GulliesPacific

Thanks for the info. I guess one has to weigh up convenience, cost of transport to/from work and location for more than just getting to the office - it's no good being in some cut-off corner of the island from which it's difficult to get out and explore (read: get drunk).

CWB or Wanchai would be IDEAL for me. Absolutely IDEAL. So I guess I need to wait and see what sort of money I might be earning before I make any decisions about ruling anywhere else out.

PeteinHongKong

It very much depends on what kind of place (i.e., size, age of building) that you are happy with and even within Wanchai there are enormous variations (I live in Wanchai close to Causeway Bay). In my old building newly renovated flats of around 600 square feet gross go for between HK$15000-17000 per month. In other parts of the district even smaller flats go for HK$25,000 plus.

hong_konger

[QUOTE=GulliesPacific;9926201] - it's no good being in some cut-off corner of the island from which it's difficult to get out and explore (read: get drunk).


Hong Kongs public transport system is very good and taxis are cheap so it doesn't matter where you live. Wanchai and Central are easy to get to from pretty much anywhere in Hong Kong.

GulliesPacific

Hi guys,

Many thanks indeed for the advise so far - apologies, also, for not popping back before now. Didn't mean to get advice and dash.

Anyway, job offer arrived this morning.

It's with a global travel company as a senior consultant working either in their head office call centre or one of their shops (one opened recently, another to open soon).

The starting salary is $16k a month, with on target earnings being a minimum of $23k but with uncapped potential.

If I were to look at renting a flat at about $14k (what do you think of this : http://www.squarefoot.com.hk/property/8862508) would this be realistic? I'm just not sure where to even start thinking about cost of living etc.

I know rents are expensive but, with that exception, you can live in HK for relatively little money.

Any thoughts on that? Should I look at sharing initially? They'll put me in a hotel for a couple of weeks initially to give me time to hunt for a flat and it seems the market is full of empty flats, so I don't imagine I'll have a problem.

But on that sort of money (is that an OK wage for HK?) how would you budget for the month?

Thanks so much

ex reg

Be aware that flat is small, not to say it wouldn't suit you.
It looks unfurnished so you'd have to spend upfront for furniture.
The kitchen looks short of room and no oven and a minute hob so cooking might be difficult.

You are hoping/believing that your commision will see you right.

You've obviously got confidence in your ability.
Will you be selling holidays etc to locals or ex pats?

Whatever, good luck to you.

GulliesPacific

Hi Reg,

Selling to both locals and expats, but the business markets itself as being of particular interest to the expat market on account of the expat workforce.

I don't really mind living in all that small a place, as long as it's nice. Space isn't a massive issue for me, but it has to be clean, comfortable and in a good area (CWB/Wan Chai being preferable).

I am a good salesperson, I know that, and I've a lot of experience in the market I'll be working, but it's still a hell of a risk to come out earning that sort of basic salary.

I hope to come to HK with GBP£20k+ 'in my pocket' as backup funds, but I'd ideally like to avoid having to touch them at all so I really am keen to find out if you can get by on, say $20k a month. Is 50% a lot to spend on apartment?

ex reg

We haven't lived in HK for quite a while now so difficult to comment on living expenses.
But although many locals do speak english I'm not sure of the %age.

Perhaps a greater %age of them are those who are looking to holiday overseas so it might not cut down too much on those you'd be able to sell to.
Mind you I reckon the locals would feel happier dealing with a local.

gumtree

Could try staying in one of the serviced apartments below (in Causeway Bay) and then find other places to move to once you're settled in fine with the job.
http://www.studiostudio.com.hk/
http://www.empirestudio.biz/

hong_konger

I would say its a fair wage but if you can supplement with commissions then all the better. You probably won't be paying much tax either.

Housing will be your biggest issue and your biggest cash outlay. You may seriously want to consider flat shares. Lots of people do that and there are plently of adverts in the local papers. You probably want to wait until you get here and find our what your colleagues do as they are probably on a similar package and there may be flat share opportunities with them.

That property on the link is nice but as mentioned above is unfurnished and very small only 469 square foot. Thats like 7 paces by 7 paces square !! Also bear in mind that electricity is not cheap and also that when you rent a flat you usually have to sign a 2 year lease (negotiate a break clause after 12 months) and you have to stump up 2 months rent as deposit and pay the rent at the beginning of the month. With the agents fee of 0.5 of a months rent you are looking at an initial outlay of 3.5 months rent + cost of furnishing etc. With a flat share you would avoid that.

Yes you can live very cheaply in Hong Kong but its just as easy to live expensively. Western produce in supermarkets is on the high side but eating out can be reasonable depending on where you go. However, drinking outside is very expensive particularly in the bars in Wanchai and Central.

Hope this helps.

penguinsix

The general guideline in most countries is 30% of your take home pay, but in Hong Kong that's quite difficult, especially given the constraints you have.

Hong Kong has some "cheap" living options, but if you are expecting to live an 'expat' lifestyle you'll find yourself short of cash very quickly. You can eat in the cheap local places, with formica tables and plastic stools eating some porridge out of a bowl, but if you are thinking of getting a steak one night or heading to a pub for some fish and chips you'll be paying more than you are paying back home. Western 'brand' goods, by and large, are more expensive here than in other places, from TVs down to a can of peanuts. If you are going to go out in an expat-pub you can expect to spend a quite a bit. I had grabbed a Diet Coke at a bar in Soho and I think it was £5 if I was doing the conversion, and this was just an average place not super fancy.

That's not to say you can't find some cheaper things, but you're going to have to do some looking. You might consider somewhere a bit further out from Central, perhaps Kennedy Town or Sheung Wan, or having a flat share.

That particular flat you listed overlooks a major road and is probably one of the worst areas of Hong Kong for air pollution (there are major backups outside most days of cars trying to get into the Central Tunnel). Not a place to open the windows.

I think the key is going to be "running the numbers". Get out Excel and do a salary calculation. After you get an after-tax figure, take a look at your budget today where you live. For your day-to-day food bills, take a look at http://www.wellcome.com.hk/en/index.php which is one of the main groceries so you can get an idea of how much the stuff you need, from washing powder to some crisps. For your 'entertainment' expenses, quite honestly beer isn't all that much cheaper here so you might want to use the figures you are currently using over there as a baseline.

If I could throw in my personal bits here, my advice would be:

a) come to Hong Kong and stay in a corporate apartment for a minimum of one month. Get the lay of the land, check things out first hand. There is so much they hide in web ads. It's not that much more expensive.

b) realize that most things listed online are 15-20% higher than you will sign for if you are here in person.

c) seriously consider a cheaper place to live in a different part of town. The transportation infrastructure is really extensive and efficient.

d) check out the HK specific expat boards, like geoexpat.com and asiaexpat.com. The classifieds on those boards are often "I'm leaving HK in four days, buy my bed/living room/tv/computer/mobile phone for pennies on the dollar!". Sometimes they are just like "free--just get it out of here please!" You can kit out your home this way pretty cheap.

Good luck.

GulliesPacific

Thanks all for the advice. Some great stuff there.

This is interesting. The prices seem VERY reasonable. How on earth can a serviced apartment cost less than, or the same as, a normal apartment? I realise that the serviced ones are maybe a wee bit smaller, but would serviced apartment living be viable long-term?

Penguin, I'd certainly consider living elsewhere in town if it were cheaper and I got more for my money. I'm quite happy paying about 50% of my salary on rent, but of course the more I get for the money the better, but I don't want to be away out in Stanley etc.

I guess I'm just quite keen to stick with what I know, initially atleast.

I've not decided whether or not to accept the job yet - I'm weighing things up first.

discobay

That's a lot to spend on housing!