ssssssarah

hi all i'm new, dont really understand this yet so bear with me...
im in my third year of studying architecture, and i'm currently on my placement year (part 1). ive got a student working visa and have booked a flight for late june, but im unsure whether to settle in toronto or montreal for the six months i have remaining until i return to university.

if working in montreal is it necessary to be fluent in french? would there be architectural practices that operate in english? i have gcse level french but they certainly dont teach you specialist architectural words at school! would i be better off in toronto?

also i was wondering if metric or imperial measurements are used in canada?!

and does anyone has any tips on where's good to look for jobs website-wise?

thanks,

sarah

clynnog

In Montreal most architects are bi-lingual although the general working language is french.

Definately, all drawings for architects are in metric. QC is probably more metric than the ROC. Some clients may want the drawings in metric but the local approving authorities want them in metric (and some will reject them if they are not only in metric). BTW..this metric things is a major debate on these boards.

gembers

Hi,
Montreal island is predominantly anglophone and being as you are on placement, for any job in the downtown area or west of downtown (westmount, ndg, west island) just speaking english will be fine (even your francophone colleagues will be bi-lingual).

Architecture-wise, Montreal has a greater variety of styles of both European and North American design but you can decide on that one for yourself.

Hope this helps

clynnog

Although you live in Mtl, to classify the island as 'predominantly' anglophone is a bit of a stretch. I would think that only the 'west island' (which isn't a geographic island would approach the predominant anglo tag. To be just speaking english in Mtl, is a fairly limiting existence I would think.

dbd33

Only because you insist on posting disingenuously. The government works in metric while the people live in imperial; buildings are in a tricky area of overlap since there are planning permissions and the like to be filed with the government while the land is purchased in imperial "n acres" and houses constructed and sold in imperial "n square feet". Someone working in a construction related field plainly needs to know both systems.

gembers

I say predominantly anglophone beacause of the Montreal gazette reporting this. Apart from most students at Concordia and McGill, most of the island is bi-lingual, but anglophone refers to people who hold English as their first official Canadian language (whether they be Anglo-Canadian, Indian, whatever). Looking past all the French signs, the skyscrapers we work in downtown house massive number of anglos!

Learning French opens up a lot more to you, being bi-lingual I have the best of both worlds, but you have to go where you feel your placement would be most beneficial to you.

Elaine B.

Totally agree. Speaking from personal experience living in Montreal and knowing very little French is a struggle.

Oakvillian

Oh, hell, I find myself agreeing with dbd again!

Architectural drawings presented for permits etc will likely be required to have metric dimensions. However, when it comes to actually getting the thing built, every construction material is supplied in imperial dimensions - drywall and plywood as 8' x 4' sheets, lumber in nominal inch cross-sections and board-foot lengths, etc. Framing is typically on 16" or 24" centres; AWG stnadards for electrical conductors are based on a square-inch cross section; pipe diameters are all in inches.

I don't work in the field, but I would be unsurprised to learn that metric dimensions on plans are typically nominal translations of imperial measurements on working drawings.

clynnog

Granted, construction material is in imperial dimensions but the drawings that are done at the beginning of the process are in metric and often in metric only. In terms of planning permission standards most if not all of them make sense in metric...ie. most parking stalls are in the range of 2.5 - 3 m wide by somwhere between 5.5 and 6 m long (3 m = 9.84 feet which if you rounded it up to 10 feet would equal about 3.14 m wide...municipalities (with the exception of Cornwall, Ontario that I have discovered) don't have dimensions like 3.14 m. They have adapted from an old imperial measurement and rounded up or down to a metric equivalent that makes sense.

As I've said before in these forums (and if it was taken the wrong way by some posters it wasn't meant that way) most people under the age of about 40 think in metric. Most immigrants from places other than the UK/US, Liberia and Myanmar (the only countries not fully metric, IIRC) are more versed in the metric system than the imperial system. My children (age 7 and 11) hear imperial measurements on TV (US TV) and are often asking me 'what does 75 degrees fahrenheit mean' 'what does 10 ounces look like' etc.

Be careful about agreeing with dbd too often..it could lead to a life up on the roof of Ontario

clynnog

It depends where in the construction process you are involved. In the drawing design end it is all in metric, the implementation and construction in the field is pretty well in imperial. However, whether or not you like it, Canada is officially metric. Home sizes appear larger in ft2 versus m2 and the same goes for acres versus hectares. That may be the reason we never see homes listed in the newspaper in the metric dimensions.

You are correct that planning permissions are in metric.

Novocastrian

Fascinating as this aspect of the OP's query no doubt is, it is hardly a matter to tip the decision s/he is facing. The language issue probably is though. I can't see the point of coming to Canada for six months on placement in architecture in going to a place where s/he'll spend the six months trying to catch up with a second language.

If it were six years, I'd suggest the opposite.

clynnog

Yes, things did get a bit OT once we hit the metric issue. If it were me, working in Mtl for any period of time I would want a working knowledge of french and in particular architectural terms.

My french is rudimentary and I've been in meetings in Montreal where I was the only anglo (so to be polite I said conduct the meeting in french and if I need clarification I'll ask), and believe me it is quite tiring having to figure out what is being decided on and provide input when everybody else is speaking in french. However, it was all a good learning experience and gave me new appreciation for people who can go from language to another w/o any hesitation.

dbd33

I'm sure that's a godsend for those who value officialdom.

ssssssarah

wow thanks guys, that really did open up quite a debate! i think i've got some good stuff to be going on with, in terms of researching the areas that some of you consider to be bilingual!

i guess if i don't get much joy in terms of finding practices that mainly work in english then i'll shift my aim to toronto, and i don't suppose i'll have much choice about whether i'll be using metric or imperial really anyway!

thanks a lot for the help so far!

dbd33

I'm sorry, it was quite unhelpful to get into the metric thing again. I have to think that for a short term position Montreal doesn't work, you're not likely to get fluent enough, quickly enough, to learn very much about any practice that might take you on. otoh, if you're willing to learn nothing from your placement, then six months partying in Montreal would be some kind of a blast and would improve your French no end.