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Old Jun 26th 2016, 4:02 am   #46
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Default Re: The world of automation

In Russia they had to destroy an AI robot for continually escaping from the Lab.

https://www.yahoo.com/tech/artificia...135153288.html
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Old Jun 26th 2016, 6:09 am   #47
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Default Re: The world of automation

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In Russia they had to destroy an AI robot for continually escaping from the Lab.

https://www.yahoo.com/tech/artificia...135153288.html
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Old Jun 26th 2016, 11:29 am   #48
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Default Re: The world of automation

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Originally Posted by Beoz View Post
Yes Garry and I differ on this.

I think you may have raised a very good point in your first post when you said people are unwilling to change and re-skill. That is going to be the key. As you said there's plenty of jobs and places available where skills are lacking. And us humans and our unwillingness to re-skill, upskill and change will slow automation adoption.

I work for a tech company so I see this stuff coming and going all the time. You mention the cloud. We have a server based product that typically has always been built on a server in someones office somewhere. This requires our techo's to configure it, a local guy to manage it, someone to create the hardware, etc. This is all moved or moving to the cloud now. The benefit for the client is that someone else provides and maintains the hardware BUT because it becomes more efficient to roll out and less hassle to grow the only men down is the people who provide the hardware (if they were smart they'd shift the building and selling to data centres).

So some of our techo's were worried they might not be needed. The opposite has happened. The "packaged cloud" comes packaged with techo's who need to constantly expand the service for the clients because it is so easy to expand it now. We can't hire enough. Clients are also hiring more techo's at the end to do the same.

So same with Ubers cars. Someone will have to write the software, and do all the other bits that go into driverless cars. Most of those companies don't exist yet.

So that's the lesson history has been telling us. The blacksmith went off and became a mechanic.

Automation will only grow as fast as we humans can upskill, adapt and change.

Oh by the way. How many jobs would the world NOT have today if the World Wide Web wasn't invented? ..... billions

Automation and tech creates work.
Completely agree. The application server and someone to look after it has been around effing years! Cloud or no cloud, regardless of host. If anything the tech stack continues to get more complicated not easier. 15 years ago people were cobbling together simple Uis accessing small data bases to automate certain types of work : now there's far more complexity to do the same thing: nothing has got simpler or automated at all. Looking after a build or integration is a full time job : it didn't even exist 15 years ago at the same scale.
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Old Jun 26th 2016, 11:50 am   #49
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Default Re: The world of automation

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Completely agree. The application server and someone to look after it has been around effing years! Cloud or no cloud, regardless of host. If anything the tech stack continues to get more complicated not easier. 15 years ago people were cobbling together simple Uis accessing small data bases to automate certain types of work : now there's far more complexity to do the same thing: nothing has got simpler or automated at all. Looking after a build or integration is a full time job : it didn't even exist 15 years ago at the same scale.
Fancy a job in a data centre? The worlds best employer is looking for staff.

https://www.google.com/about/careers/search#t=sq&q=j&d=data%2520center&li=10&j=data%252 0center
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Old Jul 20th 2016, 2:04 am   #50
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Default Re: The world of automation

Looks like Amazon have been thinking some more about how to cut delivery times and extend range. Now they have drones perching on lampposts to recharge and pick up more stuff.

https://consumerist.com/2016/07/19/a...drone-perches/
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Old Jul 30th 2016, 5:31 am   #51
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Default Re: The world of automation

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Originally Posted by GarryP View Post
Looks like Amazon have been thinking some more about how to cut delivery times and extend range. Now they have drones perching on lampposts to recharge and pick up more stuff.

https://consumerist.com/2016/07/19/a...drone-perches/
Looks like the world of automation is doing wonders for jobs growth at Amazon

http://www.geekwire.com/2016/amazon-employment-2nd-quarter/
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Old Jul 30th 2016, 7:41 am   #52
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Default Re: The world of automation

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Looks like the world of automation is doing wonders for jobs growth at Amazon

Amazon reaches new high of 268,900 employees — skyrocketing 47% in just one year - GeekWire
Why do you think they want automation?

They are still pushing, developing, and rolling out robots, and 5 seconds after they have a decent warehouse robot solution they can say bye-bye to 200,000 of those employees.

How Amazon Triggered a Robot Arms Race - Bloomberg

Quote:
About half the human labor in warehouses slogs away on simple, arduous tasks that involve moving stuff around—doing work that's the equivalent of restocking shelves in a grocery store. It's strenuous work, with employees often walking more than a dozen miles a day as part of their job. As new robots become available, particularly to e-commerce warehouses with vast inventories and complex packing operations, these are the people whose jobs will be most at risk.
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Old Jul 30th 2016, 8:10 am   #53
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Default Re: The world of automation

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Originally Posted by GarryP View Post
Why do you think they want automation?

They are still pushing, developing, and rolling out robots, and 5 seconds after they have a decent warehouse robot solution they can say bye-bye to 200,000 of those employees.

How Amazon Triggered a Robot Arms Race - Bloomberg
An explanation of the Luddite fallacy - nice and simple so that even you can understand it:
The Luddite Fallacy | Economics Help

Hope this helps
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Old Jul 31st 2016, 7:56 pm   #54
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Default Re: The world of automation

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Originally Posted by GarryP View Post
Why do you think they want automation?

They are still pushing, developing, and rolling out robots, and 5 seconds after they have a decent warehouse robot solution they can say bye-bye to 200,000 of those employees.

How Amazon Triggered a Robot Arms Race - Bloomberg
Bad business attempt to grow by firing staff. Good business grow by many means, inluding using tech and increasing staff numbers.
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Old Jul 31st 2016, 7:56 pm   #55
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Default Re: The world of automation

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Originally Posted by Amazulu View Post
An explanation of the Luddite fallacy - nice and simple so that even you can understand it:
The Luddite Fallacy | Economics Help

Hope this helps
Good article

Google, who are responsible for some of the largest amounts of automation, have more staff than ever. They did have a bit of a reduction between 2011 and 2014 but this was mainly a cull of operations team. Dead weight basically. R&D, and sales and marketing have increased year on year.

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Old Aug 1st 2016, 4:37 am   #56
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Default Re: The world of automation

I must take a picture of the 200K daily 'small' postie delivered parcels, post process at our facility. They come in bags and are tipped into cots for hand sorting at post code level. They are often wrinkled and it is impossible to read 30 pct of the addresses without being straightened out. I'd say parcel lockers are more of a solution to this than drones or any kind of automation to the door.....but there you go.... Saying you can drone most parcels is a bit like saying you can drone 80 pct of supermarket, groceries and small hardware purchase deliveries ... The skies will be endlessly full.

We've got the new containers for our large letter machine letters, they are incredibly non user (human) friendly. You'll notice them everywhere soon, as Aus post has ditched more or less overnight, the white or grey wax box type large letter containers for hard rigid slightly smaller hard grey ones, with slots that fit into each other. Just over A4 size, you will see them in your local post office or especially your local Licensed LPO very soon, if not now.

First problem with them is, the contents labels are stacked on opposing sides on each level, which means staff look into the top at every other container to read the contents.... if that top article is missorted, you've got a complete tray of missorts... at local post code level this is, which wont be dealt with until the end of the sorting process, ergo a days delay usually. People will also end up crushing fingers with them or hurting backs when they have to twist every other one to read the contents label.

Definitely not made with humans in mind.
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Old Aug 1st 2016, 4:49 am   #57
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Default Re: The world of automation

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Originally Posted by ozzieeagle View Post
I must take a picture of the 200K daily 'small' postie delivered parcels, post process at our facility. They come in bags and are tipped into cots for hand sorting at post code level. They are often wrinkled and it is impossible to read 30 pct of the addresses without being straightened out. I'd say parcel lockers are more of a solution to this than drones or any kind of automation to the door.....but there you go.... Saying you can drone most parcels is a bit like saying you can drone 80 pct of supermarket, groceries and small hardware purchase deliveries ... The skies will be endlessly full.

We've got the new containers for our large letter machine letters, they are incredibly non user (human) friendly. You'll notice them everywhere soon, as Aus post has ditched more or less overnight, the white or grey wax box type large letter containers for hard rigid slightly smaller hard grey ones, with slots that fit into each other. Just over A4 size, you will see them in your local post office or especially your local Licensed LPO very soon, if not now.

First problem with them is, the contents labels are stacked on opposing sides on each level, which means staff look into the top at every other container to read the contents.... if that top article is missorted, you've got a complete tray of missorts... at local post code level this is, which wont be dealt with until the end of the sorting process, ergo a days delay usually. People will also end up crushing fingers with them or hurting backs when they have to twist every other one to read the contents label.

Definitely not made with humans in mind.
Actually, drone delivery could be the easiest and safest way to distribute illegal drugs. Packages to self destruct upon premature landing.
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Old Aug 1st 2016, 5:44 am   #58
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Default Re: The world of automation

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Originally Posted by ozzieeagle View Post
I must take a picture of the 200K daily 'small' postie delivered parcels, post process at our facility. They come in bags and are tipped into cots for hand sorting at post code level. They are often wrinkled and it is impossible to read 30 pct of the addresses without being straightened out. I'd say parcel lockers are more of a solution to this than drones or any kind of automation to the door.....but there you go.... Saying you can drone most parcels is a bit like saying you can drone 80 pct of supermarket, groceries and small hardware purchase deliveries ... The skies will be endlessly full.

We've got the new containers for our large letter machine letters, they are incredibly non user (human) friendly. You'll notice them everywhere soon, as Aus post has ditched more or less overnight, the white or grey wax box type large letter containers for hard rigid slightly smaller hard grey ones, with slots that fit into each other. Just over A4 size, you will see them in your local post office or especially your local Licensed LPO very soon, if not now.

First problem with them is, the contents labels are stacked on opposing sides on each level, which means staff look into the top at every other container to read the contents.... if that top article is missorted, you've got a complete tray of missorts... at local post code level this is, which wont be dealt with until the end of the sorting process, ergo a days delay usually. People will also end up crushing fingers with them or hurting backs when they have to twist every other one to read the contents label.

Definitely not made with humans in mind.
Mass deployment of delivery drones is a long way off yet - and the first time that one crashes and hurts/kills someone or causes a car accident etc..........
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Old Aug 1st 2016, 7:09 am   #59
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Default Re: The world of automation

Quote:
Originally Posted by ozzieeagle View Post
I must take a picture of the 200K daily 'small' postie delivered parcels, post process at our facility. They come in bags and are tipped into cots for hand sorting at post code level. They are often wrinkled and it is impossible to read 30 pct of the addresses without being straightened out. I'd say parcel lockers are more of a solution to this than drones or any kind of automation to the door.....but there you go.... Saying you can drone most parcels is a bit like saying you can drone 80 pct of supermarket, groceries and small hardware purchase deliveries ... The skies will be endlessly full.

We've got the new containers for our large letter machine letters, they are incredibly non user (human) friendly. You'll notice them everywhere soon, as Aus post has ditched more or less overnight, the white or grey wax box type large letter containers for hard rigid slightly smaller hard grey ones, with slots that fit into each other. Just over A4 size, you will see them in your local post office or especially your local Licensed LPO very soon, if not now.

First problem with them is, the contents labels are stacked on opposing sides on each level, which means staff look into the top at every other container to read the contents.... if that top article is missorted, you've got a complete tray of missorts... at local post code level this is, which wont be dealt with until the end of the sorting process, ergo a days delay usually. People will also end up crushing fingers with them or hurting backs when they have to twist every other one to read the contents label.

Definitely not made with humans in mind.
Traditional post has already been a victim of change .... in most part involving technology. Eg letters v email.

But on the flip side it has been a beneficiary of technology too. Eg Online shopping.

But Oz post is just one organisation. Online shopping is an industry. Where online shopping didn't exist 15 years ago, look at where it is today.
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Old Aug 1st 2016, 7:43 am   #60
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Default Re: The world of automation

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Originally Posted by Beoz View Post
Traditional post has already been a victim of change .... in most part involving technology. Eg letters v email.

But on the flip side it has been a beneficiary of technology too. Eg Online shopping.

But Oz post is just one organisation. Online shopping is an industry. Where online shopping didn't exist 15 years ago, look at where it is today.
Everything changes after a while. The point I'm trying to make here is I think mass delivery by drones is a falsehood.

Best way I can give an example is for people to look at the check out queues at their local supermarket. Then see how many people check out with a very small amount of items. Imagine trying to deliver those by drone. The thing is the vast majority of parcels are small and individual items..... I just can't see drones making an impact on this market, which is by far the biggest part of the delivery market. Unless you've got a giant drone hovering with 300 items making deliveries on a ad hoc basis.

Drones are for special orders only IMO.

Unless someone can think of a system where this will work. I guess the automonous van with 2 or 3 drones in each van flying a short distance could be the go. How far away is that system though..... and will they use that system for those small quantity supermarket items as well. As far as I'm concerned it's exactly the same issue.....If anything the parcel market is more difficult as the end point.

Mass Drone deliveries are dead in the water as far as I'm concerned.... they'll take up less than 10 pct of the deliveries I reckon. We've talked and talked and talked this subject at work and the consensus is the future wishers are totally underestimating the indivdual small item volumes.

Solve the 3 item supermarket purchase by automated delivery, which will be a far easier nut to crack than small parcel delivery.... and your on the way to solving the parcel issue. I cant see it myself.
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