Wol

First the caveat emptor! We all try and help, but individuals' circumstances vary so always double check our replies!

I was not aware of the bit about government employees' pensions being treated differently, so what follows is only my own experience.

The state pension is frozen at the rate you get at time of emigration (to australia, NZ, Canada and several others). You can claim the UPP on this each year at the rate of 8%, rather than going through the long and probably abortive procedure of getting your contribution figures from the UK government.

A (non-government employee) private pension can also have a UPP tax allowance, but you cannot use the blanket 8%: you have to get your employer to provide all your contributions and then get a ruling from the ATO, who will send a letter showing the calculations and what you can claim in pounds sterling. In my case for example it is £2261 each year (which must be converted to AU$ at the ATO's average exchange rate for the financial year). Follow me so far? Also, the letter will say that this figure is unchanged for all following years.

I personally have found the ATO helpline people very helpful, although many of them have accents difficult to follow especially as they speak very quickly and use terms familiar to them but obviously not to you.

If your income/allowances affairs are not overly complicated the ATO ETax I have found in the past very good: it takes you through the return by asking questions and at the end supplies you with a tax estimate, after which you just click "lodge" and it's sent off to the ATO. Unfortunately my experience *this* year was less happy: the politicians have altered several things which make the tax even more complicated and in addition you have to register with the government portal to be able to use the online ETax - and th registration took me two days because it wouldn't accept my email address (which isn't the usual xxxx.com or xxxx.net etc.) And it kept saying it wasn't available, possibly because too many people were online together.

WRT having your pensions paid clear of UK tax, download the form from the ATO, fill it in and post to the ATO: they verify your status in Oz and send it to the UK tax office, who will arrange for your UK tax status to be closed.

Hope this helps?

goslar1961

Hi Wol, Thanks for your reply. I did speak to Centrica about my private pension & UPPs Both Centrica & HMRC had never heard of UPP! You say a private pension can also have a UPP? Since I commenced work at BG in 1979 and finished in 2000-I presume this means I would have to ask BG to provide all my contributions for those 21 years?

Wol

Yes, I'm afraid that's the case. Their pensions people will (should) have all the data for all the period you worked there including all their different entities.

There's also a further complication relating to private pensions: if you were "contracted out" with or without your consent or knowledge, part of the private pension may be subject to the same freeze as the state pension from the time of emigration (to the same countries as before mentioned.) The way the proportion is calculated (by your pension office) is esoteric and could only be dreamed up by politicians/civil servants/psychopaths. IIRC part of the freeze depends on the pre-1988 calculated pension and part afterwards. The net result in my case is that, although my company pension is indexed, the indexation applied to my own case is slightly less each year than the official rate and this, coupled with the fact that my company - bless 'em - have chosen to go along with the UK government's use of CPI instead of the RPI we were contracted to, means that my pension's shortfall gets compounded every year by a small but eventually significant amount. You may or may not find the same thing applied - it seems to be almost arbitrary.

Grayling

Are you sure?
I don't understand this

My government (NHS) pension is not taxed in the UK and is paid gross here....I pay no tax in the UK and arranged this when I came here. Neither is my wife's civil service pension.

Wol

Me neither.

goslar1961

Hi Wol & Grayling, Thanks for your replies-As far as I can see you can claim UPP (8%) only on a UK State Pension, per ATO website-not on a private pension such as BG. It's all very confusing!

Grayling

Having checked the HMRC website :

The rules are different for persons living in Australia, Canada, New Zealand and Cyprus.....you can claim exemption from UK tax on Government Occupational pensions if you move to any of Those countries.

john in oz

Wol a very good summary of things by you :-)

Wol

Correct - but only as regards the 8% blanket arrangement: as I said above, you have to provide the contributions figures for the private pension and the UPP is calculated for that based on those figures.

There's a special place reserved in hell for all those who over the years have f****d up the pensions systems in every country.

spouse of scouse

I reckon about 90% of the population would qualify as a 'simple soul' when it comes to Oz tax time, including me

I'm fine with just completing an ordinary PAYE tax return, it's when your tax affairs aren't straightforward that the rot sets in, in my brain anyway!

Scouse and I will be retiring in Liverpool and although we're going to get financial and tax advice, I've tried to get my head around the basics of receiving our Oz superannuation allocated pensions in the UK. With very little success The more I read, the more I realise that my brain is just not wired to understand complex tax/financial stuff.

Wishing you the best of luck!

goslar1961

Hi Wol, Grayling, John in Oz, BG Pensions will send me a confirmation of my pension contributions but, only from 1989-2000-they cannot trace previous 10 years! I suppose 11 years is better than nothing. Thanks-Wol for clarifying that point.
Spouse of Scouse-My brains not wired-fullstop. Anyway, I hope everything works out in the UK for you.

john in oz

There is some info on Oz super in my partner forum on this site if that helps if not just PM and I will help you out with the info you need. Cheers

spouse of scouse

Thanks John, much obliged

Reasonable

[QUOTE=Wol;11330705]First the caveat emptor! We all try and help, but individuals' circumstances vary so always double check our replies!

I was not aware of the bit about government employees' pensions being treated differently, so what follows is only my own experience.

The state pension is frozen at the rate you get at time of emigration (to australia, NZ, Canada and several others). You can claim the UPP on this each year at the rate of 8%, rather than going through the long and probably abortive procedure of getting your contribution figures from the UK government.

A (non-government employee) private pension can also have a UPP tax allowance, but you cannot use the blanket 8%: you have to get your employer to provide all your contributions and then get a ruling from the ATO, who will send a letter showing the calculations and what you can claim in pounds sterling. In my case for example it is £2261 each year (which must be converted to AU$ at the ATO's average exchange rate for the financial year). Follow me so far? Also, the letter will say that this figure is unchanged for all following years.

Hi
For me it was worthwhile getting my NI history as the UPP worked out at more than 8%. Also I have claimed the UPP for my UK pensions for some time without any ATO involvement needed. (have full records of contributions)

Cheers

Kiwipaul

Got a pleasant surprise this week, HM Tax office refunded my tax paid on my private pension in full, I thought I would have to submit a tax return to get the refund but seems not. I'm now receiving my UK company pension without any UK tax deducted
Only down side is they sent me a cheque in Sterling which I've paid into my Oz $ account but takes about 1 month to clear.