Irishteacher

Hi there,

Been in Perth for 5 years after arriving on WHV are now on a 457. We are in a position to go for the 186 through o/h employer. Which was the ideal plan all along. We both have good jobs here, but have decided that we will return to the UK in December 2016 due to the hope that we will have a bub in the next year and although Ireland is out of the question due to jobs we will return to the UK where we spent 2 years before coming here.

My query is more an opinion quest...the plan was to get citizenship so that we would always have the option of returning, I can sometimes be a 'grass is greener' person, so unlikely that'd we'd return with kids etc but would like the option. I know that sounds greedy but that's the truth.

After discovering the amount of $ we have in super here, even after 38% tax it would still equate to a healthy sum in addition to what we've worked our asses off to save already, would go nicely towards a mortgage/rainy day fund. All good on 457 with his work, no uncertainty in that respect. I guess further down the line there may be opportunity to apply for a PR visa independently so that could be our plan b.

My question is this; would you stay on the 457, take the money and run? Or would you stay get Citizenship and leave the super? Any opinions folks? TIA

movingback

If I was in your situation I'd take the money and run. Use the money to buy a house and establish yourselves back in the UK. Get on with life. I wish I had. I now find myself staying for an extra year just to get citizenship (after jumping through the hoops to get PR can't bring myself to NOT stay for it) and seeing a large pot of money that I can't touch for the next 30 yrs. Wish I was still on a 457 - I'd jump on a plane tomorrow!

Beoz

All depends how short term you want to do it. It might be a good nest egg. (Careful with the fees) or it might be good for a house deposit.

I like they way you progressed from a working holiday visa to 457. Many say that can't be done.

msmyrtle

4-5 years ago truckloads of Irish and English graduate and junior engineers were coming over on WHVs and being sponsored by the big (and not so big) construction companies to work on projects out in WA. Companies pretty much needed warm bodies to fill most of the roles.

Nowadays with most major projects over, I would seriously doubt many construction companies would even look at graduates on WHVs when they can get full-time Australian graduates.

I'm sure it *can* be done (if you were an outstanding candidate - but you'd have to be outstanding) but in my (old) field I would say it's super hard now.

astera

Very tough call, this. How long do you estimate that you would need to stay to become a citizen?

Overall this is something that will probably stay more in your mind than anything else. And peace of mind is a wonderful thing to have. If you bail out now you might forever be thinking that you should have stayed, that you missed the chance to secure that passport before leaving, etc.

And if you do stay and become a citizen before leaving, it will give you: A) peace of mind that you stayed for a valid reason and truly have something to show for it now -AND- B) the peace of mind (yet again) that you will thereafter always have the option to return should you ever wish to do so.

Funnily enough, the latter, even if you never decide to exercise that right, is a comfortable notion to live with. Just knowing that, "You can if you want. Any time."

As I said, tough call. Life is short, and if you would consider the years that it takes to gain citizenship to be a waste and you're vying to return then that might be too big a sacrifice to make...

Irishteacher

Thanks for your input people The fact is there are pros and cons. Timewise, it won't make a huge difference, maybe an extra 12 months, we won't be leaving for at least 12 months, so as soon as the 186 was granted (5/6 months from lodgement) it would be another year to be eligible plus whatever wait there is for the actual Citzenship application & ceremony. Think I'll be right for that one as I'm teaching History & Citizenship

It will make a difference to the bank balance though, paying $8k ish for the visa plus losing $40k super (between us) after tax is gonna sting

So is the option to return for peace of mind worth nearly $50k?

Re: transitioning from whv, agree that 4/5 yrs ago they were sponsoring engineers all over the shop, all my Perth friends are fifo widows. Slow down is evident with that crowd for sure. Although everyone I know here in a variety of professions got the 457 then went pr. again though, that was then this is now.

msmyrtle

Personally I would get PR and citizenship before heading back to Ireland/UK. Even if you don't come back you would be able to pass down Australian citizenship to your kid(s).

I know of two 55+ Irish men that are here because of the economy in Ireland and are on 457's, ineligible for PR. One told me that when he was in his 20's he could have gotten Canadian citizenship but he returned to Ireland and settled down, had a family, etc. After the economy tanked in the mid-2000's he was kicking himself for not taking out Canadian citizenship when he had the chance.

Beoz

You've got the dollar signs in your eyes. Looks like you are heading down that route.

1 thing in life I'm glad I did is to hold 2 passports. I've been able to ping pong back and forth from Europe to Australia at will. It was great to be able to do it in 2010 for a good salary in Oz when shit was hitting the fan in the UK. I may need to do it again in reverse.

1 thing I regret is not being a little bit more conscientious about my nest eggs in my 20's and 30's. Its not compulsory in the UK so I spent a lot of it on endless ski trips and partying. I really wished there were some forced pension contributions in the UK. If I were you I'd be getting that passport and keeping the super for its intended purpose.

astera

38% tax to withdraw it now, coupled with a weakened Aussie Dollar... that just seems like a pretty big hit to take. But of course if you are to move back and will need a mortgage instead then it might be worth lifting that burden by cashing in the super.

Overall though I'd stay and get the 2nd passport. You never know what will happen in the future (both in terms of the economy as well as politics) and the Australian passport is one of the best ones to have as an additional option.

john in oz

It is my understanding that as soon as you get PR then employer contributions from then on will not be accessible only the 457 component. :-)

louie

It isn't costing you $50k. The $50k will still be there, it just won't be accessible until later. It's an investment in your future.

+ 1. For me, it would be a (and I hate the word but will use it anyway) no-brainer. We left after nearly two years in Oz in 1989 without a passport or any intention of coming back and are now returning to live next month, having had to jump over many hoops (and earlier than we would have chosen had there not been an age cut-off for PR) to get back in. I so wish we had gone the citizenship route.

Beoz

Yep. Being a ping ponger, the option to move at will, especially when economic climates demand it, is worth its weight in gold.

Swerv-o

Certainly agree with this. I'm thinking about ponging, and having that option is much better than not...


S

verystormy

The moment you gain pr, your super is locked into Oz until you reach the relevant age. So, you will not be able to withdraw it.

Gaining citizenship is not immediate on becoming eligible. It will take at least 6 months. Maybe 12 as it depends on several factors including your local council.

If you do not foresee yourself moving back, I would not bother.