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Positive signs in the Australian Real Estate Market

Positive signs in the Australian Real Estate Market

Old Oct 20th 2013, 11:43 am
  #31  
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Default Re: Positive signs in the Australian Real Estate Market

Originally Posted by commonwealth
House prices are up nationally between 5 and 7 per cent over the past year, while income growth over the same period is up about 5 per cent.

Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/money/analysts...#ixzz2iGDttZel
What are the increases compared to income growth for the last 10 years or so? I suspect house prices increased greater than income for a number of those years, and are greater than they should be if matched with income growth.
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Old Oct 20th 2013, 11:45 am
  #32  
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Default Re: Positive signs in the Australian Real Estate Market

Originally Posted by chris955
Im not sure how people being completely priced out of the market can be considered a positive sign to be honest.
I agree, and it's been happening in the UK for 10-12 years. Australia seems to be a few years behind in this.
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Old Oct 20th 2013, 11:47 am
  #33  
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Default Re: Positive signs in the Australian Real Estate Market

Originally Posted by roaringmouse
I agree, and it's been happening in the UK for 10-12 years. Australia seems to be a few years behind in this.
Yet the UK remains much more affordable
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Old Oct 20th 2013, 12:04 pm
  #34  
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Default Re: Positive signs in the Australian Real Estate Market

Originally Posted by roaringmouse
What are the increases compared to income growth for the last 10 years or so? I suspect house prices increased greater than income for a number of those years, and are greater than they should be if matched with income growth.
did supply of housing grow with demand for housing?

that's the fundamental question. supply v demand.

no, we don't have enough stock of housing for the population growth we're experiencing as well as investor demand from overseas.
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Old Oct 20th 2013, 12:09 pm
  #35  
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Default Re: Positive signs in the Australian Real Estate Market

Originally Posted by Grayling
Yet the UK remains much more affordable
Not so sure how it is now but at the end of 2010 it was much cheaper to live there.
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Old Oct 20th 2013, 12:25 pm
  #36  
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Default Re: Positive signs in the Australian Real Estate Market

I haven't seen that much of the world but the greed in the world of NZ real estate takes some beating; property owners, real estate agents take as much as they can possibly get. Its just another commodity.
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Old Oct 20th 2013, 1:09 pm
  #37  
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Default Re: Positive signs in the Australian Real Estate Market

Originally Posted by Grayling
Yet the UK remains much more affordable
In Australia and the UK, home ownership is sitting at 69%/70%, there's little difference between the two countries. In Australia the HO rate has fallen just 1% since 1990 and this is largely attributed to a greater stock of rental properties, particularly in the larger cities CBD's (think overseas investors).

An OECD study of home ownership in leading countries found that HO rates have increased in the UK mainly (3/4 of rise) because of a change in the structure of households i.e. an ageing population; other factors are at play in Australia. eg, OECD says:

"Overall, changes in household characteristics can account for around three-quarters of the increase in aggregate homeownership rates in Austria and the United Kingdom over the decade from the mid-1990s to mid-2000s, but only around one-third of the increase in Canada, Germany, Spain, Switzerland and the United States. In Australia and especially Italy, other factors appear to have played a particularly important role in shaping homeownership patterns."

In other words it isn't as simple as 'more affordable' in the UK, the population is ageing and older people have a higher rate of home ownership - they aren't first time buyers.

OK, you might think it's difficult to get your foot on the property ladder presently but 1st time buyers are just one sector of the market. Home owners are always moving (different location, sizing up, sizing down, moving job, nest emptying etc) and when the property market picks up then people have greater geographic and all types of mobility which must be a better thing for many.
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Old Oct 20th 2013, 1:38 pm
  #38  
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Default Re: Positive signs in the Australian Real Estate Market

Originally Posted by Grayling
Yet the UK remains much more affordable
Maybe in the north. Not in the south. That great north south wealth divide 'they' go on about
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Old Oct 20th 2013, 9:32 pm
  #39  
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Default Re: Positive signs in the Australian Real Estate Market

Originally Posted by Beoz
Maybe in the north. Not in the south. That great north south wealth divide 'they' go on about
Where do you call the south?

I have been looking to buy a house in Cambridgeshire, about and hour from London, and the houses are far more affordable than where I live now which is about an hour from Brisbane......I also know Oxford well and that is similar in price to where I am now.

what am I missing?

Brisbane is hardly the equivalent of London

Last edited by Grayling; Oct 20th 2013 at 9:37 pm.
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Old Oct 20th 2013, 9:35 pm
  #40  
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Default Re: Positive signs in the Australian Real Estate Market

Originally Posted by OzTennis
In Australia and the UK, home ownership is sitting at 69%/70%, there's little difference between the two countries. In Australia the HO rate has fallen just 1% since 1990 and this is largely attributed to a greater stock of rental properties, particularly in the larger cities CBD's (think overseas investors).

An OECD study of home ownership in leading countries found that HO rates have increased in the UK mainly (3/4 of rise) because of a change in the structure of households i.e. an ageing population; other factors are at play in Australia. eg, OECD says:

"Overall, changes in household characteristics can account for around three-quarters of the increase in aggregate homeownership rates in Austria and the United Kingdom over the decade from the mid-1990s to mid-2000s, but only around one-third of the increase in Canada, Germany, Spain, Switzerland and the United States. In Australia and especially Italy, other factors appear to have played a particularly important role in shaping homeownership patterns."

In other words it isn't as simple as 'more affordable' in the UK, the population is ageing and older people have a higher rate of home ownership - they aren't first time buyers.

OK, you might think it's difficult to get your foot on the property ladder presently but 1st time buyers are just one sector of the market. Home owners are always moving (different location, sizing up, sizing down, moving job, nest emptying etc) and when the property market picks up then people have greater geographic and all types of mobility which must be a better thing for many.
Is this aimed at me in some way

I am not a First time buyer....I have owned several properties and am a cash buyer....What is your point?
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Old Oct 20th 2013, 11:15 pm
  #41  
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Default Re: Positive signs in the Australian Real Estate Market

Originally Posted by Grayling
Where do you call the south?

I have been looking to buy a house in Cambridgeshire, about and hour from London, and the houses are far more affordable than where I live now which is about an hour from Brisbane......I also know Oxford well and that is similar in price to where I am now.

what am I missing?

Brisbane is hardly the equivalent of London
Go on. Give the stats then.

When I judged a 2 bedroom terrace 10km from Sydney CBD and a 2 bed terrace same distance in south London they came out about even on fx rate a year ago. Things may have changed in the past year but considering my salary conversion was 2.3 when I first arrived Sydney would be the more affordable option for me.
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Old Oct 20th 2013, 11:31 pm
  #42  
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Default Re: Positive signs in the Australian Real Estate Market

Originally Posted by Beoz
Go on. Give the stats then.

When I judged a 2 bedroom terrace 10km from Sydney CBD and a 2 bed terrace same distance in south London they came out about even on fx rate a year ago. Things may have changed in the past year but considering my salary conversion was 2.3 when I first arrived Sydney would be the more affordable option for me.
So where do you call the south?
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Old Oct 21st 2013, 10:16 am
  #43  
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Default Re: Positive signs in the Australian Real Estate Market

Originally Posted by Grayling
Is this aimed at me in some way

I am not a First time buyer....I have owned several properties and am a cash buyer....What is your point?
Not aimed at you at all. UK and Australian property markets are different. With respect to affordability, I'd expect much lower home ownership in Australia than UK if property is more affordable in the latter but that's not the case.

The exchange rate blurs comparisons of property prices between Australia and the UK - over the last few years Australian property, vieiwed from the UK or with £'s in hand, has got 25% dearer at least just on the falling pound if you convert prices to the other currency. Brits buy with £'s and British salaries and wealth and interest rates; Aussies buy with $'s and Aussie salaries and wealth.

Brisbane isn't London yep but more to the point Cambridge isn't Brisbane. A lot of people buy in East Anglia (and as far north as York and beyond) to commute to London. Compare Cambridge prices to somewhere an hour from Brisbane and see what you get.

If we look at facts and not impressions:

Ipswich median house price is $366,500 (£215K at current rate);

Brisbane median house price $444,000 (£261K);

Source: Google Ipswich median house price/Brisbane house price

Cambridge median house price £357,639.

I rest my case - average Cambridge house price is nearly £100K above Brisbane (even at the high current value of the AUD).

Source: http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/shared/spl/h.../html/12ub.stm

Move out into the Fens and property becomes a lot cheaper of course (but the same goes for BrisVegas).
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Old Oct 21st 2013, 10:31 am
  #44  
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Default Re: Positive signs in the Australian Real Estate Market

Originally Posted by OzTennis
Not aimed at you at all. UK and Australian property markets are different. With respect to affordability, I'd expect much lower home ownership in Australia than UK if property is more affordable in the latter but that's not the case.

The exchange rate blurs comparisons of property prices between Australia and the UK - over the last few years Australian property, vieiwed from the UK or with £'s in hand, has got 25% dearer at least just on the falling pound if you convert prices to the other currency. Brits buy with £'s and British salaries and wealth and interest rates; Aussies buy with $'s and Aussie salaries and wealth.

Brisbane isn't London yep but more to the point Cambridge isn't Brisbane. A lot of people buy in East Anglia (and as far north as York and beyond) to commute to London. Compare Cambridge prices to somewhere an hour from Brisbane and see what you get.

If we look at facts and not impressions:

Ipswich median house price is $366,500 (£215K at current rate);

Brisbane median house price $444,000 (£261K);

Source: Google Ipswich median house price/Brisbane house price

Cambridge median house price £357,639.

I rest my case - average Cambridge house price is nearly £100K above Brisbane (even at the high current value of the AUD).

Source: http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/shared/spl/h.../html/12ub.stm

Move out into the Fens and property becomes a lot cheaper of course (but the same goes for BrisVegas).
That is a very selective use of figures.
Your figure of $444000 for Brisbane would include an awful lot of areas where you would not really want to live. Try finding anything in a reasonable suburb within easy reach of the centre of Brisbane for that amount:lol

I live in a 'reasonably' priced suburb of Brisbane (at least 45 mins from the centre at off peak times) and that figure would get you very little here either.
My experience is that the UK is far cheaper than Australia anywhere near the major cities....and that is based on living and buying property in both.

Last edited by Grayling; Oct 21st 2013 at 10:40 am.
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Old Oct 21st 2013, 10:54 am
  #45  
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Default Re: Positive signs in the Australian Real Estate Market

Why are you referring to the 'average' house price in Cambridge being 100K GBP higher than Brisbane when prior to that you had been using the 'median'.......not trying to muddy the water are you?
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