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Employment contract

Employment contract

Old Jun 3rd 2012, 7:47 am
  #16  
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Default Re: Employment contract

Originally Posted by paddym

The job I currently hold in the uk is as secure you could possibly imagine. No risk of being let go and if there was there is a long process and a lot of expense and red tape to get through just to be even close to being rid of anybody within my company. I suppose I'm looking for the same security. Even if the contract I had had a minimum term on it.

So if you screwed up big time or the company went under, you would keep your job regardless? Wow, that's some job. Not sure I'd leave it.
What's Australian law like in regards to this because anybody I know in the uk can't just be told that they are being let go out of the blue. Surely if that hppened it would be a case for unfair dismissal
Sorry but bullshit. I've been made redundant four times in the UK. If the company has to cut back on staff or go under, they can get rid of you, no matter what.

In this current economic climate, no one's job can ever be described as rock solid.
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Old Jun 3rd 2012, 8:06 am
  #17  
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Default Re: Employment contract

Originally Posted by paddym
Hey guys,

When negotating a contract of employment on a 457 visa what are the key points to negotiate to make sure my job is as secure as it can possibly be?
I'm afraid securityisnt going to happen its basically for short term positions. If it makes you feel better there isn't much security in permanent positions either.
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Old Jun 3rd 2012, 11:50 am
  #18  
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Default Re: Employment contract

Originally Posted by moneypenny20
Sorry but bullshit. I've been made redundant four times in the UK. If the company has to cut back on staff or go under, they can get rid of you, no matter what.

In this current economic climate, no one's job can ever be described as rock solid.
Sorry to hear that but the job I am in is rock solid. Unless I break the law in some sort of way or punch my boss in the face I would have it for life.

How long have you lived in oz and how secure have your jobs been? Many times you been let go in oz?

That can be a question for everyone. Many times have all of you been let go while working in oz?
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Old Jun 3rd 2012, 12:03 pm
  #19  
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Default Re: Employment contract

Originally Posted by paddym
Sorry to hear that but the job I am in is rock solid. Unless I break the law in some sort of way or punch my boss in the face I would have it for life.

How long have you lived in oz and how secure have your jobs been? Many times you been let go in oz?

That can be a question for everyone. Many times have all of you been let go while working in oz?
I work for Queensland Govt, which has had many many years of a culture where a lot of staff were on temporary contracts. i know people who have been on frequently renewed contracts for upwards of 10 years. Many of these are frontline government jobs and because of that the postholders have been certain they had a job for life. A couple of months ago a change of government, and a Premier with an anti-public service attitude.
I have friends who have been loyal and hardworking employees for donkeys years, who have mortgages, families, loans etc all based around a steady government salary, but for various reasons their job titles include the word "temporary" or "contract". All out of work at 2 weeks notice. Simple as that, no recourse, jobs gone.
Others returned to their substantive roles - so overnight their income plunged from Senior Manager to Admin Officer.
Even people taken on to implement changes under the Flood Commission in case of (god forbid) more events like last summer, are now out of a job. That work is now all on the back-burner, so lets pray for a few dry seasons.

Australia has a very different attitude to employment, and job security is not one of its priorities.
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Old Jun 3rd 2012, 12:05 pm
  #20  
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Default Re: Employment contract

Originally Posted by paddym
Sorry to hear that but the job I am in is rock solid. Unless I break the law in some sort of way or punch my boss in the face I would have it for life.

How long have you lived in oz and how secure have your jobs been? Many times you been let go in oz?

That can be a question for everyone. Many times have all of you been let go while working in oz?
Don't apologise, I don't think any of them were down to you, it's just how it is for the vast majority of people whatever country they're in.

Here, one job and been let go once. Husband four jobs, let go twice.
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Old Jun 3rd 2012, 12:18 pm
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Default Re: Employment contract

Originally Posted by moneypenny20
Don't apologise, I don't think any of them were down to you, it's just how it is for the vast majority of people whatever country they're in.

Here, one job and been let go once. Husband four jobs, let go twice.
Has it been difficult with finding another job after being let go? Has oz been a good or bad experience for you?
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Old Jun 3rd 2012, 12:25 pm
  #22  
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Default Re: Employment contract

Originally Posted by Pollyana
I work for Queensland Govt, which has had many many years of a culture where a lot of staff were on temporary contracts. i know people who have been on frequently renewed contracts for upwards of 10 years. Many of these are frontline government jobs and because of that the postholders have been certain they had a job for life. A couple of months ago a change of government, and a Premier with an anti-public service attitude.
I have friends who have been loyal and hardworking employees for donkeys years, who have mortgages, families, loans etc all based around a steady government salary, but for various reasons their job titles include the word "temporary" or "contract". All out of work at 2 weeks notice. Simple as that, no recourse, jobs gone.
Others returned to their substantive roles - so overnight their income plunged from Senior Manager to Admin Officer.
Even people taken on to implement changes under the Flood Commission in case of (god forbid) more events like last summer, are now out of a job. That work is now all on the back-burner, so lets pray for a few dry seasons.

Australia has a very different attitude to employment, and job security is not one of its priorities.
I would have thought a government job would be more secure as well. The company I am going for is quite small with 80 plus employees so am a little cautious as they aren't a global super power or that.

It's a big decision to make, I am not looking at first to move to oz for the rest of my life but I want the experience and practice what I do here in the uk at least for 2 years for it to be a success.

I know a lot of people are forced abroad for work family etc but I am a 26 year old civil engineer. Live with parents here (no house to get rid of) no kids. Have a good job and no debt keeping me here. I want to experience oz before I am tied down to something.
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Old Jun 3rd 2012, 12:55 pm
  #23  
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Default Re: Employment contract

Originally Posted by paddym
Has it been difficult with finding another job after being let go? Has oz been a good or bad experience for you?
Well it was last August and I've still not found anything. Plenty of thanks but no thanks and just as many 'nothings'. We love it here, the last three years have been non stop major medical problems for all of us, plenty of work crap, a total lack of money, but none of it is down to Aus, shit happens.
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Old Jun 3rd 2012, 9:49 pm
  #24  
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Default Re: Employment contract

Originally Posted by paddym
I would have thought a government job would be more secure as well. The company I am going for is quite small with 80 plus employees so am a little cautious as they aren't a global super power or that.

.
I wouldn't sweat that too much - global superpowers are usually way more ruthless than small companies - if you fit into a small company the owner/directors know all the staff and are usually reluctant to ditch people unless there's no alternative - in global firms they cull with impunity and have very little consideration for how it affects the people on the ground - only their bottom line.

(this is obviously only my opinion based on my working life but I'd be really surprised if people found the opposite other than the occasional exception to prove the rule- whatever that means!)
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Old Jun 4th 2012, 1:44 am
  #25  
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Default Re: Employment contract

Originally Posted by Pollyana
I work for Queensland Govt, which has had many many years of a culture where a lot of staff were on temporary contracts. i know people who have been on frequently renewed contracts for upwards of 10 years. Many of these are frontline government jobs and because of that the postholders have been certain they had a job for life. A couple of months ago a change of government, and a Premier with an anti-public service attitude.
I have friends who have been loyal and hardworking employees for donkeys years, who have mortgages, families, loans etc all based around a steady government salary, but for various reasons their job titles include the word "temporary" or "contract". All out of work at 2 weeks notice. Simple as that, no recourse, jobs gone.
Others returned to their substantive roles - so overnight their income plunged from Senior Manager to Admin Officer.
Even people taken on to implement changes under the Flood Commission in case of (god forbid) more events like last summer, are now out of a job. That work is now all on the back-burner, so lets pray for a few dry seasons.

Australia has a very different attitude to employment, and job security is not one of its priorities.
I used to work for the department of communities in Brisbane and left about 8 months ago. I have friends who have all lost their jobs with contracts not being renewed and people who have been downgraded to junior level after being in roles for years.

Grown mature, people crying at the thought of having no work and having to then look into a flooded market and chasing anything they can get, its a cruel world and an ineffective government with blinkers on have created this monstrosity. No role over here is permanent, I am an IT contractor so take the rough with the smooth, but for some people, longevity is the key to existence.

In summary, and I started on a 457, try and do a good job, word gets around as Brisbane is a small place and networking is key. Keep your nose clean, work harder than the australians and dont expect to be given anything for free. I found you have to work a lot harder over here than the UK to prove yourself and build the relationships needed to be successful further down the track.

Good luck

PS I hate the commute from the Goldy to Brisbane on the Bombay Express :-)

Last edited by seanpears99; Jun 4th 2012 at 1:46 am.
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Old Jun 4th 2012, 12:30 pm
  #26  
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Default Re: Employment contract

Originally Posted by seanpears99
I used to work for the department of communities in Brisbane and left about 8 months ago. I have friends who have all lost their jobs with contracts not being renewed and people who have been downgraded to junior level after being in roles for years.

Grown mature, people crying at the thought of having no work and having to then look into a flooded market and chasing anything they can get, its a cruel world and an ineffective government with blinkers on have created this monstrosity. No role over here is permanent, I am an IT contractor so take the rough with the smooth, but for some people, longevity is the key to existence.

In summary, and I started on a 457, try and do a good job, word gets around as Brisbane is a small place and networking is key. Keep your nose clean, work harder than the australians and dont expect to be given anything for free. I found you have to work a lot harder over here than the UK to prove yourself and build the relationships needed to be successful further down the track.

Good luck

PS I hate the commute from the Goldy to Brisbane on the Bombay Express :-)
Thanks for all the information and advice you have provided.

I'm reading all these comments over and it seems to be horror story after horror story, why the hell would anyone want to go live in Australia. Can anyone answer that?

All I am getting from this thread is you get no security, have to try and get anything you can in a flooded market, work harder than you would in the uk just to hold onto your job then unfortunately you get the grown men and woman in tears.

Is it worth it? From this thread it doesn't seem so. Why put yourself through all that for what? The lifestyle, weather? Doesn't seem like you would have a life if you where working your ass off just to hold a job down not knowing when they are going to tell you to bugger off and find somewhere else.

I have done a lot of research and this is the first I have came across this response and I am sorry all you people have had to go through these situations.
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Old Jun 4th 2012, 2:11 pm
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Default Re: Employment contract

Originally Posted by paddym
Thanks for all the information and advice you have provided.

I'm reading all these comments over and it seems to be horror story after horror story, why the hell would anyone want to go live in Australia. Can anyone answer that?

All I am getting from this thread is you get no security, have to try and get anything you can in a flooded market, work harder than you would in the uk just to hold onto your job then unfortunately you get the grown men and woman in tears.

Is it worth it? From this thread it doesn't seem so. Why put yourself through all that for what? The lifestyle, weather? Doesn't seem like you would have a life if you where working your ass off just to hold a job down not knowing when they are going to tell you to bugger off and find somewhere else.

I have done a lot of research and this is the first I have came across this response and I am sorry all you people have had to go through these situations.
I love it here, I loved it there. Shit happens everywhere you just make the best of it wherever you are. Just because we're having a totally crap time physically and financially doesn't make us think it's Australia, it must be a crap place, we'd better get out. We just find a positive spin and get on with it. If you cut and ran every time something went pearshaped, you wouldn't sit still for more than a fortnight.
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Old Jun 4th 2012, 6:11 pm
  #28  
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Default Re: Employment contract

Originally Posted by moneypenny20
I love it here, I loved it there. Shit happens everywhere you just make the best of it wherever you are. Just because we're having a totally crap time physically and financially doesn't make us think it's Australia, it must be a crap place, we'd better get out. We just find a positive spin and get on with it. If you cut and ran every time something went pearshaped, you wouldn't sit still for more than a fortnight.
So can you tell me what the good points of living in Australia are?
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Old Jun 4th 2012, 7:06 pm
  #29  
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Default Re: Employment contract

Originally Posted by paddym
So can you tell me what the good points of living in Australia are?
Going snorkeling before or after work, weekends feeling like holidays, the weather, friendly people, walking to work over the harbourside bridge every day, etc etc etc.

I'm back in London now though.
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Old Jun 4th 2012, 10:48 pm
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Default Re: Employment contract

Originally Posted by paddym
So can you tell me what the good points of living in Australia are?
Hi Paddy I dont mean to be the harbinger of doom, Australia is the best decision I ever made. I am just making you are aware that its not an easy transition, there are lots of stresses apart from just working that people need to be aware of.

Lots of people are going back because of these stresses. Sunshine isnt just the answer but Australia can offer you a bloody fantastic lifestyle. I almost live on the water, have a new car, 2 year contract with a massive company, jet ski at weekends, have a beautiful black lab and a wonderful wife who I met after emmigrating with someone else. Life is what you make it, I would rather not work but I have to.

I earn a huge salary and I am very lucky to do so, but that comes at a price, I leave for work at 6am and get back at 7pm, in the dark, have dinner then go to bed in the week. Live for the weekends, but at least its no where near as cold in the winter so you can still do stuff without freezing your nads off.

I got diagnosed with a chronic illness over here (sarcoidosis) and have to deal with that and everythign else but as moneypenny says, everyone has shit to get through.

Dont make your decision based solely on this board, we are not you and I emmigrated without ever being here before, hate spiders, love the weather and I am never going back.

Sean
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