Abuse of Australian citizenship ?
Aug 22nd 2013, 3:36 am
#16
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Re: Abuse of Australian citizenship ?
What amazes me are the stories of people who have been here for 30 years and then get deported for the reasons you describe. Living in a place for 30 years and not taking out citizenship is more of an affront than taking it out and leaving, in my view.
Aug 22nd 2013, 4:49 am
#17
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Re: Abuse of Australian citizenship ?
Knew there was a reason you wanted it! Plus you get a little tree to look after
Of course, seems perfectly reasonable to me - but they still don't intend to "live"here for the rest of their lives so where does that leave them where the OPs ideas are concerned?
So many different reasons, I don't think anyonbe has the right to judge anyone else's decision cos they can't possibly know all the reasonimg behind it.
I did it cos it was cheaper than getting a RRV every 5 years. No way could I say whether I intend to live her for ever cos I can't see into the future.
Hypocritical people abusing the citizenship system - shocking. So, assuming you have no intention to return to the UK, OP, when are you planning on renouncing your British citizenship? Or is that different? People hold multiple citizenships because they can and it gives them options. How are you any different to those you judge?
I did it cos it was cheaper than getting a RRV every 5 years. No way could I say whether I intend to live her for ever cos I can't see into the future.
Aug 22nd 2013, 5:28 am
#18
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Re: Abuse of Australian citizenship ?
I know a guy who came to Australia when he was 2 with his parents from the UK ..... as Aussie as they come but is only a permanent resident on a UK passport as he has never been bothered to go through the citizenship process ......... he is now 47
Aug 22nd 2013, 5:33 am
#19
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Re: Abuse of Australian citizenship ?
If you look at some of the high profile cases of people like this who face deportation one of things that comes up is a disbelief that they can be told to leave "their" country. They feel that way because they were raised here like your acquaintance. The fact is if you're not a citizen, you're not a citizen, full stop.
Aug 22nd 2013, 6:00 am
#20
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Re: Abuse of Australian citizenship ?
When you apply for Australian citizenship the application form asks you to sign a declaration which states: "I declare that I intend to reside or continue to reside in Australia or maintain a close and continuing association with Australia".
Time and time again I have read posts on here from people who state they are staying in Australia just long enough to get their citizenship and then intend to return to Britain.
I presume in many cases this means selling your house, closing your bank account and taking all your worldly goods with you.
My question to these people is how will you abide by the above declaration you sign when you apply for citizenship if you have no intention of living in Australia after gaining citizenship ?
A warning on the form above the declaration before you sign states: "It is an offence under section 50 of the Australian Citizenship Act 2007 to deliberately make, or cause to make, a false or misleading statement, or conceal circumstances in relation to an application."
As other posts on this forum have shown the government can bring in new rules without warning or consultation eg WA to charge 457 visa holders school fees and the changes to the rules on the Fringe Benefits Tax.
It wouldn't surprise me if the government suddenly decides to change the citizenship rules to ensure people have to prove they intend to maintain ties with Australia after being granted citizenship to plug this loophole.
I can understand people may have to return to their native country after acquiring citizenship for circumstances beyond their control eg death of a family member or breakdown of a relationship but it seems to me too many people are abusing the citizenship process.
A couple I know,who lived here for 8 years, spent the last 12 months slagging off Australia every opportunity they got but stayed long enough to get their citizenship and have gone back to Wales. Their constant criticisms of Australia became very tiresome.
They took everything with them and as far as I know have nothing to show they are maintaining "a close and continuing association with Australia". Talk about being hypocritical.
Time and time again I have read posts on here from people who state they are staying in Australia just long enough to get their citizenship and then intend to return to Britain.
I presume in many cases this means selling your house, closing your bank account and taking all your worldly goods with you.
My question to these people is how will you abide by the above declaration you sign when you apply for citizenship if you have no intention of living in Australia after gaining citizenship ?
A warning on the form above the declaration before you sign states: "It is an offence under section 50 of the Australian Citizenship Act 2007 to deliberately make, or cause to make, a false or misleading statement, or conceal circumstances in relation to an application."
As other posts on this forum have shown the government can bring in new rules without warning or consultation eg WA to charge 457 visa holders school fees and the changes to the rules on the Fringe Benefits Tax.
It wouldn't surprise me if the government suddenly decides to change the citizenship rules to ensure people have to prove they intend to maintain ties with Australia after being granted citizenship to plug this loophole.
I can understand people may have to return to their native country after acquiring citizenship for circumstances beyond their control eg death of a family member or breakdown of a relationship but it seems to me too many people are abusing the citizenship process.
A couple I know,who lived here for 8 years, spent the last 12 months slagging off Australia every opportunity they got but stayed long enough to get their citizenship and have gone back to Wales. Their constant criticisms of Australia became very tiresome.
They took everything with them and as far as I know have nothing to show they are maintaining "a close and continuing association with Australia". Talk about being hypocritical.
Aug 22nd 2013, 7:27 am
#21
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Re: Abuse of Australian citizenship ?
If you look at some of the high profile cases of people like this who face deportation one of things that comes up is a disbelief that they can be told to leave "their" country. They feel that way because they were raised here like your acquaintance. The fact is if you're not a citizen, you're not a citizen, full stop.
Aug 22nd 2013, 7:32 am
#22
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Re: Abuse of Australian citizenship ?
Yes the only difference is they dont have the piece of paper. I do find the thread title quite odd, why is it abuse? There is no reason why it should be any different in Australia than anywhere else. Citizenship for many is a matter of convenience.
Aug 22nd 2013, 10:25 am
#24
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Re: Abuse of Australian citizenship ?
The point is that they possibly came when the were very young. When they were 18 they went on the electoral roll like all their mates so wouldn't give citizenship a thought. When you vote etc you don't think about it. I was here for 36 or so years before I became a citizen. Didn't see the need until Mr Keating began to change things. I also nagged my eldest two sons to do the deed - which they eventually did.
Aug 22nd 2013, 10:29 am
#25
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Re: Abuse of Australian citizenship ?
The point is that they possibly came when the were very young. When they were 18 they went on the electoral roll like all their mates so wouldn't give citizenship a thought. When you vote etc you don't think about it. I was here for 36 or so years before I became a citizen. Didn't see the need until Mr Keating began to change things. I also nagged my eldest two sons to do the deed - which they eventually did.
Aug 22nd 2013, 10:30 am
#26
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Re: Abuse of Australian citizenship ?
The point is that they possibly came when the were very young. When they were 18 they went on the electoral roll like all their mates so wouldn't give citizenship a thought. When you vote etc you don't think about it. I was here for 36 or so years before I became a citizen. Didn't see the need until Mr Keating began to change things. I also nagged my eldest two sons to do the deed - which they eventually did.
Aug 22nd 2013, 10:38 am
#27
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Re: Abuse of Australian citizenship ?
I dont think anyone has said anybody wouldnt know what nationality they are. I think the point is that if you have grown up in a country from a very early age you dont even give it a thought.
Aug 22nd 2013, 10:48 am
#28
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Re: Abuse of Australian citizenship ?
Doesn't matter whether you "buy" it or not, those who come here as small children consider themselves Australian because they know nothing else. It may seem strange to you but people who have lived here for forty years or so never think of nationality unless circumstance brings the subject up. You may consider yourself English and I know I'm a Scot but no matter where they were born my sons considers themselves Australian, as do many others of their generation.
Aug 22nd 2013, 11:15 am
#29
Daffyd Duck
Joined: Jul 2008
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Re: Abuse of Australian citizenship ?
This is worth a response!
In my view the OP makes a valid point. It is common today to take out Auscitz before returning to Britain, and not out of patriotism.
The Sunday prog featured a family last year who swore allegiance to Aus and then flew back to the UK 10 days later! (What a beat up that story was for other reasons!).
They did it to keep their options open, as do most of them nowadays.
The thing is, irrespective of the legal small print, I don't think the AusGov gives one damn! They know full well what is going on, and I suspect see it as par for the course, because many of those folks will return to Aus.
So they get the ebb and flow of a populace.
I haven't done it, because there is no need. I was never Australian, it was not my intent; it just happened. For me personally, it would be hypocritical to take out Auscitz. It was never an option.
In my view the OP makes a valid point. It is common today to take out Auscitz before returning to Britain, and not out of patriotism.
The Sunday prog featured a family last year who swore allegiance to Aus and then flew back to the UK 10 days later! (What a beat up that story was for other reasons!).
They did it to keep their options open, as do most of them nowadays.
The thing is, irrespective of the legal small print, I don't think the AusGov gives one damn! They know full well what is going on, and I suspect see it as par for the course, because many of those folks will return to Aus.
So they get the ebb and flow of a populace.
I haven't done it, because there is no need. I was never Australian, it was not my intent; it just happened. For me personally, it would be hypocritical to take out Auscitz. It was never an option.
Aug 22nd 2013, 11:19 am
#30
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Re: Abuse of Australian citizenship ?
Doesn't matter whether you "buy" it or not, those who come here as small children consider themselves Australian because they know nothing else. It may seem strange to you but people who have lived here for forty years or so never think of nationality unless circumstance brings the subject up. You may consider yourself English and I know I'm a Scot but no matter where they were born my sons considers themselves Australian, as do many others of their generation.
