Mitzyboy

Well ........ I just re read the thread and I found that the advice that was given to you has been quite informative, based on peoples real life experiences, and probably worth taking note of. If one "sarcastic" comment is enough to put you off this forum then I'm wondering how much resolve you will have to live in SA.

Anyhow, good luck and I hope it all works out for you

Daxk

Just read through the thread too, I assume you read my post as sarcasm??
It was'nt!! and not meant to be.

If I won the biggest Euromillions tomorrow I would not return to live there,even tho my Mother,Brothers and sister are still there.

There is such a shortage of skills worldwide, especially in Engineering and Construction that there are a lot of other places around that offer better weather and a lot more safety for you and your child.
That was my point.

Mitzyboy

No Daxk, I think she meant 1066

Tegwyn

That is exactly right Pablo. People come on here asking the same old questions that have been answered time and again, and get their knickers in a knot when they don't get the answers they are hoping for. I thought the BBC and Sky were doing a good job of covering the crime factor in SA. I guess not good enough. If all folk had to worry about is hiding your bag and computer, then we would all be cheering. If think the OP will get eaten alive in Africa if she can't handle the little dark humour manifested here.

Daxk

Mumble,Mutter,...Bloody 1066 always has all the fun....
I actually wonder if we all did a 180 and extolled SA as the safest place on Earth, long walks in the veld,newly born Does nibbling at your childrens feet,Kids dissappearing for hours on end on their Bikes etc,no burglar bars Cars left running with the baby in the back while you quickly run in for a Litre of Milk, sitting outside counting the stars till midnight without a Fence in sight.?

Would the Positive bunnies who get on my case also do a 180 and issue more warnings than you need to be careful and you'll be ok and SA has some problems but its got great weather...

Or would they say that no-one can live like that anymore.
(unless you live here where I do that is )

Tegwyn

I actually remember a time when mothers would leave their babies in prams in a shady area outside the supermarket when they ran in to get their milk!!! I was a young girl then. How quickly it all changed.

Pisces

This is obviously a very emotional subject to South Africans. We felt we had to leave the country of our birth and everything familar to give our children a future. We have torn apart our families and have to try and make a home in other countries.
I am in Australia and I have had to accept that my children will be Australian and will probably marry Australians. If we get homesick we cannot just pack up and go back to SA, we have to stay and make a go of it.
I love it here because it offers my children the way of life that I had in South Africa as a child. To be able to go to the park and to walk in the bush, to ride their bikes on the streets , to walk to the shops and school, but it will never be "home".
We have to accept that we will probably never get to see some of our family again - nephews, nieces and cousins.
You do get angry, upset, emotional having to leave elderly parents behind and at Christmas when all the families around you are with their families you are on your own. My children don't know their grandparents or aunts, uncles and cousins and ask to see them all the time.
Would I go back to SA if law and order were restored ? Of course, in a heartbeat.

Bijilo123

Assume there is now law and order.

I certainly would not there is no future for me in South Africa as a white male under BEE. I accept that things have changed and the balance of being safe in SA under the circumstances you propose and earning and doing well somewhere else is a no brainer to me.

Pugsy

Yes, the fact is that most of us here have made greater emotional sacrifices in leaving the country we love, than others will ever understand. It is very tempting for newbies to believe that the crime is hype, it is obviously what they want to hear. I thought the OP had quite friendly replies actually.

1066

Oi, I'm hurt!

I never even mentioned the bad points!!

Tegwyn

That's your fault then.....

1066

gilliana

wow...what a thread...

I'm South African, living in UK (3years now due to a work transfer). You can all point fingers at me for this choice - single mom - good career opportunity...blah blah i didnt leave cos of the crime albeit i was in Cape Town (i did live in joburg during the 90s till 2001 - but relocated cos of job) Anyway I will now standing up for SA, I agree your posts are stating it as it is. I think what I found quite shocking was the malice at which some give "advice".. are you attacking people who even dare consider SA an option? Some remarks are quite hectic.

Life is what you make it. Violent crime is high in SA, along with other problems, but hey ho...its a beautiful country... I just find it hard to stomach South Africans berating the country. It would be interesting to know who still lives there and who doesnt. If you not all in SA, why waste time making sure you write as much negativity as you ...get on with your new life in your new country. Let other people have their own adventures in SA..

I am waiting for the next lot of threads to really have a go at me, but just chill - people going there know about the crime and its not an idyllic safe island, but a bit of encouragement with added caution would go a long way to help people visit, enjoy, explore, invest in the country...

I dont have an idealistic view either. I love SA and I will return when I have those pounds saved up (yes, and its cos I would need to invest in good security..so?)

Daxk

I'm always intrigued.
No matter how bad things get,how bleak the outlook, how much I fear for my Family, there's always the yes...but game (Those old enough will remember TA and Harris 's "I'm Ok you're Ok.")
And it always revolves around scenery.
and invariably,its either you must hate the Country or why dont you get on with your new lives... and do you still live here??

I would be grateful if Gilliana, as Fidi Defensor of SA could give me cold hard fact instead of fuzzy reasons why my Mother, Siblings ,Neices and Nephews are safe and have a future in the SA she hopes to return to.
And no, Gilliana, not attacking you.Just asking what cold logic makes you feel as you do?

gilliana

cold logic? my whole family, most of my friends live in Joburg/Durban/CT ..its not cold logic.. i have this umbilical cord connected to South Africa. Those who live there (and 40% of my family have UK passports, me not being one of them) choose to live there, because they love South Africa and they make sacrifices...Now its not sacrificing your life or those of your children, its just a choice - why condemn /condone when ones chooses to live and when British people enquire as to living there - why portray SA as a country in total anarchy with nothing going for itself... that is not realistic - you are seeing one very bad side and you focus on that. I would not choose to settle permanently in UK - like i said, here on a work transfer. Opportunity came up, relocation expenses paid, secured job - change of scenery. My own little adventure, but its not home and its not forever UK either...

I dont yanker after the scenery of the highveld, Table Mountain, horizons, golden beaches, SPACE etc etc... its the people. Its my family who have no inclination of leaving, its the jokes you can share with the petrol pump attendant, its the same in-grown understanding and necessity we as South Africans have that we fend for ourselves; no dependancy culture and tiresome trivial moaning of post arriving late (in the UK) ...or watching my neighbour get excited about feeding her goldfish on a sunday morning... You either exist or you live.. Risks are involved everywhere. My 7-year old son does not go on his bicycle near the woods where we live. You need to watch for groups of thugs, deceiving cos they could be as young as him... In SA, at least we know what to look out for...every youngster here in a hoodie on his BMX i steer clear of if we in the park. Look at the gangs, stabbings and anti-social behaviour going on with the youth here...I do not want my son to attend high school here. The bullying, the disrepects towards teachers...blah blah and i could on and on. So is there a perfect place to raise children?
Don't get me wrong - I understand and I know the violent crime is at unacceptable levels in SA. Within 3months, we were burglared, hi-jacked etc... but South Africa is part of Africa. Its not a first world country. It surfaced from years under an apartheid regime, the poverty and unemployment is the source of the problem. These are all facts, these are reasons why leave cos its not our problem and too risky for family - nobody is condeming you for leaving. But people want to stay and make a difference, people want to go there...at least try be a champion for SA - if you born and bred and reaped the benefits of apartheid, then why prevent every other human on the earth from living/visiting there by slagging the place off.

With every bad - there is good. You either choose to focus on the bad, because all you see are threats and risks. Then ok. We dont all have that perception. I go to SA three times a year. I dont freak and hide under the bed during my holiday waiting for something bad to happen to me.

As I said before, yes I will return after my contract expires because.....

Its the vibrancy and the pulse of South Africa. In South Africa, you are reminded of your mortality every single day. Those are my fuzzy reasons.